In this episode, Jim and Tyson will ask each other 5 random questions. They will both answer each question and let us get to know our lawyer hosts better.
Questions:
Jim:
1. If you had to point to an event or experience in your childhood or young adulthood that shaped who you are as a lawyer or signal the lawyer that you would become, what is it?
2. What is one thing you are doing that you should stop doing?
3. If you were not practicing criminal or PI law, what practice area would you choose?
4. In the last two weeks, what percentage of your time spent working was performed doing work than you and only you could do?
5. A few months ago you said on the podcast that you would be starting your weekly email newsletter the following week. Have you done it?
Tyson:
1. How much would you sell your firm for? Why?
2. Same as Jim
3. If you could not practice law, what would you do? Why?
4. Are you Successful? Why?
5. What attorney inspires you the most?
Hacking’s hack: A book. Content Inc.: How Entrepreneurs Use Content to Build Massive Audiences and Create Radically Successful Businesses (Business Books) Hardcover – September 8, 2015
by Joe Pulizzi (Author)
In Content Inc., one of today’s most sought-after content-marketing strategists reveals a new model for entrepreneurial success. Simply put, it’s about developing valuable content, building an audience around that content, and then creating a product for that audience.
Tyson’s tip: A book. Profitable Podcasting: Grow Your Business, Expand Your Platform, and Build a Nation of True Fans Paperback – September 14, 2017
by Stephen Woessner (Author)
The word is out: content marketing is king. But when nearly every business has a blog, it’s tough to stand out. The real secret is that there’s a much better tool for spreading influence and generating revenue–one with far less competition.
Thanks so much for listening to the show! If you want to know more about this and keep on maximizing your firm, please join our Facebook group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/403473303374386/ or like us on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/MaximumLawyerPodcast/ and comment!
You can also go to http://www.maximumlawyer.com/ or, if you’d prefer, email us at: info@maximumlawyer.com
Do you want to get on the show? Shoot us an email or message us!
The Maximum Lawyer Podcast. Partner up, and maximize your firm.
Resources:
- Join the Guild Membership
- Subscribe to the Maximum Lawyer YouTube Channel
- Follow us on Instagram
- Join the Facebook Group
- Follow the Facebook Page
- Follow us on LinkedIn
Transcripts: 5 Questions to Get to Know a Lawyer
Jim Hacking
Generally, I’m doing way too many things that I don’t need to be doing. And I really need to spend some more time doing what you have done. And that is really pushing things down. And you know, sort of what we preach about making sure that, you know, there are systems in place to do some of the routine things. This is gonna be my focus for the next six months.
Tyson Mutrux
You’ve got to systemize it. You’ve got it. Yeah, no, you got it. You’re working on it. But I think that that’s going to relieve a lot
Unknown Speaker
of pressure. Run your law firm the right way. This is the maximum liar, podcast, podcast, your hosts, Jim hacking and Tyson metrics. Let’s partner up and maximize your firm. Welcome to the show.
Jim Hacking
Welcome back to the maximum lawyer podcast. I am Jim hacking.
Tyson Mutrux
And I’m tasting matrix. What’s going on Jimmy?
Jim Hacking
Oh, Tyson, I’m excited getting ready to go to John Fisher’s mastermind event this week, it’s going to be a pretty exciting event. I’m looking forward to seeing a lot of our friends there and getting to share some of the issues we’ve been working on here at the firm and to learn from some really smart lawyers.
Tyson Mutrux
I’m super jealous, you’re going down Gary burgers going down, a lot of people go down, I guess that down, they’re going up to price bandwidth, it’s going to be they’re hosting the mastermind. Pretty awesome. I have a four to six week long jury trial starting in a few weeks. And so that’s why I’m not going because I’m spending time with my family before I am going to be preoccupied for a long time. So and we’ve also obviously get trial prep. So I would go up super jealous. It’s gonna be a great time. I went a couple of years ago in Chicago, and I’ll be going again, once I can free up my schedule. So but do you want to get into this week’s topic? I’ll sort of introduce it, and then we’ll get going. Okay, go with that. Let’s do it. Alright, so here is the topic of the week. Jimmy and I each have five questions, we’re gonna ask each other. We don’t know what those questions are going to be. So we’re just going blind. So without much more introduction than that, Jimmy, you want to go ahead.
Jim Hacking
All right. And so I’m going to, I’m going to flip the table on you a little bit, we are going to do exactly what you just said, we’re going to ask each other the question, but when our opponent or the other person is done answering that question, then we have to answer that question that we asked ourselves, how do you like that? Deal? I
Tyson Mutrux
like it. Alright,
Jim Hacking
let’s get started. You Ready? Ready? Let’s go. Question number one, if you had to point to an event or experience in your childhood or young adulthood that shaped who you are, as a lawyer or signal the lawyer you would become what is
Tyson Mutrux
if I gotta come to the one moment, in my childhood, I mean, I’m not gonna give you one moment in my childhood, I’m going to give you a series of moments because my dad, and this is going to be sort of hard to believe that it’s hard for me to believe, but it’s actually it’s absolutely true. My dad gets up at like, 430 every morning, and then he doesn’t do it anymore. That night, the season before 30. But he would work. And then he would come home. And then he would be up till like 1011 12 night working even more, and you do it every single day. And I could never understand it. I mean, I would try to get up with him. I try to stay up with him. Like, I don’t know how it’s physically possible for a human being to go on his little sleep as he did and as he has. But so I would say that I watched my dad work really, really hard every single day. And so I tried to mimic that. But I can tell you, I can’t work as hard as my dad. I mean, I tried. It is super hard to do. So I’d say that just work ethic. I think that’s, that’s what I would point to what about you?
Jim Hacking
That’s funny that you bring that up, because I was thinking about my dad, too, when I was writing this question. And you know, you and I sit behind a desk all day and act like it’s hard labor. But you know, our dads were doing physical work, my dad would work a full time job. And then he would come home at night and he would build decks for people. So he would do it all by himself, he would engineer it, he would dig the ditches, he would, you know, put in the postholes and do everything himself. And so he would work. Like your dad, he would go to work early in the morning, come home, have dinner, and then he would work for three or four hours building decks for our neighbors. And that’s sort of how he paid for us to go to private high schools. But the event I was going to talk about was when I was 15. He dropped me off at the corner of Clayton Road and Brentwood and said Jimmy, don’t come home until you have a job. And so I walked into Dillards they were getting ready to build the Galleria. And I walked in to the personnel department and I met this guy and he hired me. He was like, Do you want to work in security and you can stand outside and help people out to their cars while they’re doing this construction? I said, Oh yeah, sure I can do that. So it just sort of set the tone for me. I’m not afraid to try new things and sort of go outside my comfort area. And that’s sort of something that stands out for me.
Tyson Mutrux
So it sounds like so your dad had two jobs. That’s what sounds like
Jim Hacking
pretty much in a business on the side where he was just building decks for people. Yeah. Interesting.
Tyson Mutrux
So my brother of our pair in both of our dads had two jobs and guess what my dad’s job was he’s a mechanic, right. And so he’s always been a mechanic and he worked in cars. But then his second job was he talked to dealer into allowing him to actually clean the facility. And he basically they get rid of the cleaning company, and then they hired him. And so his entire job, if you’ve ever looked at a dealership, those things are big. So he spent a long time every night. That’s what he did, he would go back to the dealership and clean the dealership. That was his job. So it’s interesting, both of our dads, they both did some manual labor. And they also had two jobs. But alright, let’s get on to my first question. It is, I’m thinking about this now. But and now you flip the table on me a little bit, but how much would you sell your firm for? And why?
Jim Hacking
Oh, that’s a great question. I don’t think my firm is ready to be sold. You know, we’ve talked on this podcast before about and one of my favorite books Built to Sell and about how it was an ad agency that was trying to do everything for everybody, all kinds of marketing and stuff. And that he kept drilling down drilling down becoming more and more niche more and more focused, eventually to the point where he had systems built out to, to just do logos. And so people would come to him and offer him money to do other kinds of marketing. And he would turn it down. And I just think it’s a great short little book that our friends who listen to the show should read, it’ll really help you think of your business as the product is ation of the law and sort of making it much more systematic. A lot of the ways that you have Tyson, I don’t think my firm is ready to be sold. I don’t think it’s going to be ready for a while I think that it’s a little bit too personality based. But if you’re asking me if I you know what I think it’s worth right now, I think it’s worth a lot. We’re our numbers are up, we’re keeping really busy. I think that we would need a little bit more formality and some more systems and sort of, for me to step away from things, but that’s really what I’m trying to work on anyway. So I just don’t think I’m there yet.
Tyson Mutrux
Okay, fair enough. Fair enough. I get to answer the question, I sort of my firm is not for sale, but I’m through Infusionsoft I’m technically selling what my firm does. So I’m not going to put that price on it. I think if I’m going to put a price on mine, I’ve got to take into consideration. We don’t own any of the office spaces. So I can’t really put that into the into the as a factor. But we do have some brand recognition, we do have a large client base. We have, you know, all the office equipment, everything else, and then the systems are set up. So I think I know an attorney can actually walk into our firm start practicing right away. I mean, I’m gonna actually answer the question. This is a complete ballpark. And I’m probably overestimating what my client base is worth extended, we have got some cases in the hopper that are probably, you know, some multimillion dollar cases and less than things go really bad. I’d say at price sell my firm part of the ongoing high is probably $10 million. The reason I’m saying that is because I don’t want to sell my firm. And my firm’s probably not worth that. But I get excited to want to sell it for fair enough.
Jim Hacking
And million dollars, man, I wouldn’t give you 10 century.
Tyson Mutrux
Today, like I wouldn’t set let’s say I’m doing way high, because I don’t want to sell my firm. So that to walk away. So this is just the walk away. So someone said, Hey, here’s me walk away from your firm. That’s what I do. But other than that it wouldn’t sell. I get your next question.
Jim Hacking
Question number two, what is one thing that you are doing that you should stop doing?
Tyson Mutrux
So funny? I the exact same question for you. What’s one thing that I am doing, I need to stop doing that probably. And that’s something that we are transitioning is into is the day to day handling cases. My role at the firm is transitioning into more of a kind of a CEO role. In a way, we’re not calling it that. But I will be handling more of the planning the strategy, what a CEO does, and then trying cases. I don’t want to give up trying cases. I think realistically maybe that’s what they should stop giving out. But I don’t want to I enjoy doing too much. So the debt so they answered the day to day activities that’s answering phone calls, or returning phone calls or talking to adjusters. He’s like that I just didn’t just stop doing that. So what’s your interest?
Jim Hacking
So this is what I’m going to talk at the mastermind group about I wrote up you know, John has this write up sort of what we’re struggling with sort of our hotseat segment. And, yeah, this is totally me. I just need to get myself out of the day to day business of the law. And I know it’s important. I know that there are still some cases that I’ll probably have to hold on to But you called me out a couple of weeks ago, we were on the phone just chatting. I was working on a lawsuit. And you’re like, why are you drafting a lawsuit? And I said, Oh, because only I can do it. But if I sat down and took the time to build out the system to draft this kind of a lawsuit, it’s actually pretty straightforward. It’s just a matter of plugging in names and dates and sort of the limited number of events. And I could totally automate that and outsource it to other people. So I just really need to push these next six months on getting myself out of the day to day stuff.
Tyson Mutrux
mark my word. Whenever you go to this mastermind tomorrow, I think most of the people that are in that room are gonna have the same problem you do. But there’s gonna be a couple that have found a way out of it. And hopefully, Craig Goldfarb there, because he’s on his way out of that. I’m not sure if he’s gonna be there or not. But again, yes, instead Oh, yeah, I’m sorry, I didn’t think about the SF SF definitely has to. So you need to listen to those guys, for sure. Because I’d say most of the people there are gonna have the exact same problem that you have a guy I’m excited about this. I’m curious to see what you’re gonna say. If you couldn’t practice law, what would you do and why?
Jim Hacking
If I was no longer a lawyer, I would go all in on Infusionsoft. And I would teach people how to use it. And I would help businesses, you know, I love talking to people in all kinds of businesses, not just the law, in how to, you know, develop the before unit, that’s sort of my bag, you know, you’re definitely the during unit, but I love talking about, you know, getting leads conversion, all that stuff, how to do, you know, campaigns and marketing. And that’s one thing I would do, the other thing I would do is I would write a novel, I have a couple of novels that I’d love to write and in my head, and I would spend a lot more time writing, and I enjoy practicing law, I wouldn’t want to leave it, I enjoy building something. So it would be a bummer for me to not be a lawyer anymore, but I could definitely keep myself busy.
Tyson Mutrux
Right? So I have two answers. If I were to start all over again, right? This is where the one answer comes in. And this is I love practicing law, too. I wouldn’t choose this over practicing law. But if I were to do it all over again, and I couldn’t practice law, then what I’d probably do is actually become an engineer, and become an engineer because of what you just said, I love building things. And I think you know that about me. And that’s why I spend so much time with Infusionsoft is, I like to build things. So I would probably do that. But firstly, if if for like today, I just couldn’t practice law anymore. After already practicing law for several years, I would probably do something like you and I are both certified partners. And so it’d be an easy transition. It allows us both to build things. And we can help other people build their law firms. So I think it’d be a combination of consulting. And then also diving deep into Infusionsoft. I’m already selling the campaigns. And so it’s an it’s a natural transition for me, and I enjoy doing it. So I think it’d be really easy. What’s so Alright, give me your next question.
Jim Hacking
Number three, if you were not practicing criminal or PII law, what practice area would you choose?
Tyson Mutrux
I don’t practice criminal anymore, technically, because we’re not bringing in new criminal cases, even though I just tried a federal case a couple weeks ago. So if I were to practice another practice area, well, it would be something that I can streamline, it’d be something that I can easily automate. You have a practice area? That is actually something you can practice across the country, which I liked that about it. I don’t really like immigration. I’m not a big fan of nutmeg. But no, not that I’m big fan. I’m not a big I don’t have big interest in immigration law. So I don’t think I’d want to do immigration. But I would like to do something that I can do across the country, because that way, I can sort of expand faster and target bigger client base. That’s a tough one. You know, I’ve got one, there is a vaccine Courtright. Can I use this even though stop personal injury? There’s a vaccine court in Washington, DC. And so there are vaccine cases across the country. And so I consider this completely separate practice area from personal injury because most I’ll do it. It’s federal, I would do vaccine court cases. That’s what I do. Because I can sit St. Louis, or Columbia, whichever one and actually take cases across the country. They’re all handled out of Washington, DC. That’s what I do. I would do vaccine court cases.
Jim Hacking
Wow, that’s pretty, pretty narrow Tyson and pretty limited. I mean, any kind of federal litigation scheme, everyone I know has come across those things have really hated them. Anyway, if it were a
Tyson Mutrux
year, federal year the federal litigation escapes you love Yeah. What are you talking about? Yeah, but
Jim Hacking
I don’t know. It’s just hard to get my juices flowing for vaccination litigation, but whatever floats your boat for me. I do it on something that I could do nationally. And I think that our friend Joey, Vitaliy has an interesting thing going with trademark and copyright. I think that’s something that’s federal, that’s nationwide that you’re helping people, you would allow us to use our creative expertise. And I think that that’d be something interesting that I’d like to try.
Tyson Mutrux
When he kills the two. He’s doing great. I agree. That takes you a really good one too. But dad, I would do something like that just because you can’t you can systemize it for sure if you can systemize anything, but it just makes it more difficult to systemize. And so I guess what if you did just trademarks or just patents or just something specifically in IP law, I think you could definitely streamline those, especially the applications with everything but there’s some other things that he does I think maybe a little more difficult to streamline. But I That’s a good one. I like it because it does get the juices flowing. So I’ve got an The next one is for you. And I’m really excited to hear your answer this one. Are you successful? And why? Oh,
Jim Hacking
yeah, I’m successful. And I don’t mean to say that in a braggy way, I just, I have the law firm that I always wanted. I mean, I have my problems, I have the issues that I’m struggling with. But, you know, my tip of the week or my hack of the week is coming up, it’s a book that I’m going to discuss. And one of the concepts he had in there is that so many people think that there’s safety in having a job with a boss and a paycheck. And I was just relishing listening to that chapter of the book. Because you and I, you know, took risks on ourselves, we bet on ourselves and, and knock on wood. So far, it’s paying off. And we’ve built these lives. I mean, I get to practice with my wife now. And we have this firm that, you know, she thought she had the most stable thing ever working in a law school and the law school had a lot of problems. So to be able to take her in and have her join the firm and make such an impact as she has and for us to be able to work together and, and to work five minutes from home and be able to go see my kids at school whenever I want. And, you know, it’s the money is like fifth on the list. It’s just this lifestyle that I don’t have a board of directors, I have to run my YouTube videos by, I can say whatever I want on Facebook Live or in a blog post, and, and we’re making money and our message is resonating with people and we’re really impacting people’s lives. So yeah, I think in every which way, I feel like I’ve been successful I, I certainly have plenty to learn and could do better and a lot of different things. But overall, I couldn’t be more satisfied with the job that I have.
Tyson Mutrux
So I get absolutely everything you just said same thing. I don’t have a boss, right. I could spend time with my family. I spent far more time with my family than I did when I was working for another guy. And that guy was a jerk. So I will say to her, I love my job. I love coming to work. I mean, he’s the you and I are sitting on the phone right now chatting about, you know, practicing law, they will we love it because we love doing it. So absolutely, I was up till one o’clock last night working not because I had to, because I wanted to. And so you and I we get to do everything it will get to what we want, we get to get to market if we want to, we had to try cases that we want to, we had to practice law, what do we have to do we want to do. And so I agree with you. And we also get to spend time with our family, you and I both value that a lot. We value spending time with their family. And we do that. So we have jobs that provide us with with comfortable incomes that allow us to do those things. And so I can echo everything you said. So I think that’s good answer, I get your next one.
Jim Hacking
Number four, in the last two weeks, what percentage of your time spent working was performed doing work that you and only you could do?
Tyson Mutrux
Oh, actually the majority of it, because we started our 12 week goals yesterday. And so most of last week, I spent actually doing the goals, I spent a long time on these goals. So I’d say the majority of it, the what percentage, I’d say something like 25%, something like that, which is may not sound like a lot, but that’s quite a bit. Now. And I’m counting for there are things I could just completely cut out that I can’t do that I don’t need to do. So I think I’m being fair by saying 55% I think we spend most attorneys spend most of their weeks. And 95% of it is they are things that you shouldn’t be doing that someone else should be doing. So I’d say probably 55% right around there. What about you?
Jim Hacking
So this is the one question that I wanted to ask you and to not have to answer myself. And now we did move last week. So things are a little bit hectic, and I was probably doing some, it’s probably not a good week to check. But just generally I’m doing way too many things that I don’t need to be doing. And I really need to spend some more time doing what you’ve done. And that is really pushing things down. And you know, sort of what we preach about making sure that you know, there are systems in place to do some of the routine things. I’m gonna give myself a 20% on this one. And I really this is this is gonna be my focus for the next six months, or maybe 12 weeks,
Tyson Mutrux
you got to systemize that you’ve got to know you gotta know your workout. But I think that that’s, that’s going to relieve a lot of pressure. Okay, so next question, though. We’re on to the next one. What attorney inspires you the most?
Jim Hacking
That’s a great question. When I graduated from college, I got hired to work at a law firm helping with a plaintiff’s case. And I came across and met an attorney who’s been my biggest mentor and a great friend. His name’s John Simon. And John is one of like nine kids. His parents came from Lebanon back in the 60s, and they owned a fruit and vegetable stand at the schoolyard market. And I think all of their kids have college degrees, all nine of them. And most of them have advanced degrees. And John was one of the best bosses, probably the best boss I’ve ever had. He’s a very successful attorney in St. Louis. He’s got his own firm, he has about 50 people working for him. But he’s the most humble guy, when he used to win a case, he would leave court, if the day was half over, and he’d go down and work in the market with his dad for about a day and a half just to sort of ground himself. And Dan has great stories about you know, living at the market when he was a kid and hustling and working, and I just learned a tremendous amount from him. If I could ever be half as successful, and half the lawyer that he is, I would consider myself to have done a very good job.
Tyson Mutrux
The really good answer, that’s a fantastic answer. And that’s actually going to tie into a little bit. Well, my answer is going to be exciting. anticipate having to actually answer this question. But so I thought about No, I thought about John Fisher, you know, I thought it was set price Craig golden far, Miss jacks and things like that people that that might inspire me. And I thought about thought about John Simon, John Simon is a phenomenal attorney. He’s a great trial attorney, a great person, you introduced me to him, he’s he’s just amazing guy. I’d say that, John Simon’s probably who I aspire to be. I’m not sure he’s the guy that inspires me. That makes sense. He is an incredible guy, incredible attorney. And we actually model a lot of our practice to be like John Simon’s firm. So that is, if I could be like him, that can be amazing, you know, because he’s just amazing. But I hate to admit this, but I say the person that inspires me the most Jimmy’s probably you suffer D, that’s probably because you’re gonna want to clip this for the rest of your life. Because you push me probably more than anybody. And you, you practice what you preach. So you get on here, you’re on the podcast, he talks about things and you actually do them. And if you don’t do them, you say it. So I think that that I think what pushes me the most, who pushes me the most is probably you. So you probably put forth the most inspiration out of me. So I’d say my law partner has a crisp, and he does two quite a bit. But I’d say the person that probably doesn’t the most is probably you. So I’ll give you some credit for that. So you might want to clip this, save it, put it next to your pillow, and then just sort of think about overnight. So
Jim Hacking
yes, this is so great. Because I do have one last question. And it’s a zinger for you. I set it up perfectly. And you’ve given me a great intro. Are you ready for it? Yeah, go ahead. Question number five, a few months ago, you said on the podcast that you would be starting your weekly email newsletter The following week. Have you done it? And if not, why not?
Tyson Mutrux
Do this, Kevin? Gosh, damn it. I actually anticipate this freakish question, because you emailed me yesterday, and you asked me about it. Why not? I have I know, I’d say why not? I will say why not is because of the transition of the new firm. There’s a lot of work if your take two firms, you know, this is a big excuse, by the way. I’m gonna take this as an excuse, but you take two firms that are doing really well. And that would they have their own systems, their own employees, and you meld those firms together, it is substantially more work than what you will ever anticipate. And so we spent a ton of time trying to meld those two firms. And there was a big gap in US actually marketing things, because we’re coming up with logos, slogans, everything else. But there’s a big gap. And actually, from the time we actually started the firm to the time we actually started marketing again. So my excuse is the merging of the firm. However, Chris and I are working on one. So one is coming, I promise, but not yet. So that’s a crappy answer. But that’s my answer. All right, well take it. And you don’t have to answer that question because you have a weekly newsletter. So that’s what I want to end with. Get to your hack of the week.
Jim Hacking
My hack of the week is a great book I just started about a third of the way through, it’s called Content Inc, by a guy named Joe bluesy. And he talks about, you know, building an audience first. Now, that’s the keys of any business’s success. And he says that, within the content realm, you’re going to like this a lot that the greatest indicators of success for people that use content for marketing are a written content calendar, and regularly reviewing that written content calendar. So pick up that book, it’s a good book, and if you can start working on your content calendar, it’s something we’ve been talking about a lot on the Facebook group. And I think that that’s something that I’m going to implement very shortly.
Tyson Mutrux
If people want to email us or put on the Facebook page that they you know, they want to sample the content calendar I gave one out here was a couple years ago when we spoke to those attorneys and we I actually gave out a content calendar and I even mapped out and key holidays that were not as your typical holidays throughout the entire year. For I think that was two days. and 15. So as we did in 2014 2015 is whenever was with calendars for the people message me, I’ll try and find that. And I’ll give that up to everybody. So the actual dates gonna be a little different, but the holidays will still be there. And I’ve got a spreadsheet I can share too. So people reach out to us, I can do that with content calendars. That’s a good one of my tip of the week is a book. And this is a gift from Larry Weinstein that he sent to me and I’ve been reading through it, it’s really good. It’s by Steven Woessner. And it’s profitable podcasting, grow your business, expand your platform and build a nation of true fans. So our tips and hacks sort of build off each other with your book. So more of a building, you know, so this guy is really good. It gives scripts and things like that. It’s really, really good. Definitely that you should use it. I haven’t used really much of read in today’s podcast because it’s a little different podcast. But Jimmy, I will let you see this once I’m done reading it, but it’s a really good book. Sounds good brother. Check us out on Facebook. Give us five star review on iTunes or wherever you get your podcast and we’ll check you next week.
