Tyson Mutrux sits down with immigration attorney Audra Doyle to discuss what happens when the practice area you've built your law firm around starts changing beneath you. From purchasing her first firm to building an unconventional partnership, Audra shares the decisions that shaped her business and why she's now considering another major shift as immigration law becomes increasingly unpredictable.
How to Build a Network That Fuels Your Firm with Alycia Vail Taylor
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Are you a lawyer who is looking for advice on starting a firm? In this insightful episode of the Maximum Lawyer podcast, Tyson engages in a discussion with Alycia Vail Taylor, founder of the law firm, Avail. Alycia shares her journey and innovative strategies for standing out in the crowded legal marketplace.
Alycia shares some misconceptions of working in the legal field. One of them is that lawyers are greedy and only want to work to make money. But, for Alycia she came to the realization that it is possible and sometimes needed to be accessible to your clients to ensure they get the support they need during stressful times. This could be monetary or adjusting your working style. Alycia embeds community and service into her firm’s mission to ensure those in her community can make connections and network for other services.
Alycia and Tyson chat about marketing across different legal practices. Marketing for different practice areas can be tough and very time consuming to ensure you are reaching a wide range of people. It does involve utilizing multiple social media platforms to reach different audiences. Since Alycia has a community based model, it helps to get the word out there through community partners on what the firm offers.
Take a listen to learn more!
Episode Highlights:
- 05:30 Advice for Law Students
- 14:45 Revenue Generation for Law FirmsÂ
- 16:07 Potential Subscription Model for ClientsÂ
- 22:09 Health and Wellness Importance
- 26:08 Virtual Firm ServicesÂ
- 35:10 Marketing for Multiple Practice AreasÂ
- 45:25 Managing a Law Firm
Connect with Alycia:
Resources:
- Join the Guild Membership
- Subscribe to the Maximum Lawyer YouTube Channel
- Follow us on Instagram
- Join the Facebook Group
- Follow the Facebook Page
- Follow us on LinkedIn
Transcripts: How to Build a Network That Fuels Your Firm with Alycia Vail Taylor
Speaker 1 00:00:02 This is maximum lawyer with your host, Tyson Matrix.
Tyson Mutrux 00:00:11 So, Alicia, in a crowded marketplace, fitting in as a failure in a busy marketplace, not standing out is the same as being invisible. That's a Seth Godin quote. Okay, so I wonder what your thoughts are on then I can reread it if you want.
Alycia Vail 00:00:26 Yeah, I know right. I was like, yeah.
Tyson Mutrux 00:00:28 It's kind of hit you hard. Hold on. Yeah. So in a crowded marketplace, fitting in is a failure. In a busy marketplace, not standing out is the same as being invisible,
Alycia Vail 00:00:37 Yeah. Okay. I could see that. Absolutely. And it kind of sucks because it's just, like, not standing out as a failure. Like, that's the part, of course, right? That really hits you because it is crowded. But services are still unique and especially in the legal world. So I feel like whenever you're able to meet the clients where they are, then it's just easier to stand out. But yeah, I mean, I think it's just tough.
Alycia Vail 00:01:00 That's also the nerve wracking part. It made me not want to start a firm because it's like, what more can I add to this? Yeah.
Tyson Mutrux 00:01:06 So how do you stand out? Because you I mean, you're in Atlanta, right? It's a very big city. Yeah. One of the biggest in the country. So how are you able to attract clients stand out.
Alycia Vail 00:01:17 So it's cool because I market myself as the Georgia Peach attorney. And that's because.
Tyson Mutrux 00:01:21 I love, by the way. It's great.
Alycia Vail 00:01:23 Yeah. So I'm from southeast Georgia initially originally. And then I moved to northwest Georgia. Spent a lot of my life there. Dalton Carpet capital of the world in case.
Tyson Mutrux 00:01:33 Okay. I did not know that.
Alycia Vail 00:01:34 I got I got southeast Georgia, Okefenokee Swamp carpet capital of the world in Dalton, northwest Georgia. And then I landed here in the metro Atlanta area when I became a lawyer. And so I have connections all over the state. So say that I'm able to hit markets where other people in the metro Atlanta area are not.
Alycia Vail 00:01:51 And I'm also willing to travel where they're not willing to travel to.
Tyson Mutrux 00:01:54 Yeah. So did you you weren't from here, right? Right. Okay. So it is. It's kind of a bold thing to start in a city where you didn't grow up. Right. I mean, how hard was that?
Alycia Vail 00:02:05 Terrifying. Nerve wracking. But I got most of my legal work in, like, history here. So I did start by interning a little bit in Waycross. And then when I moved to Dalton, I got my first legal assistant job. But then coming to Atlanta for law school really helped build my legal knowledge as well as my connections. And so it made me feel a little bit more confident with the mentors that I had to go ahead and start it. But even they suggested, hey, since you do have these connections, other places you want to try to lean into those places instead of just the metro Atlanta area. And thankfully, my network, they just continue to cheer me on far from far away.
Tyson Mutrux 00:02:40 So it's nice having having that cheering section. Yeah, it's really good.
Alycia Vail 00:02:44 Absolutely.
Tyson Mutrux 00:02:45 Yeah. So you're I mean you're from a small town. How many people were in it.
Alycia Vail 00:02:50 Well now listen I don't I don't know I'll just say my graduating class was like maybe 30 something. Maybe.
Tyson Mutrux 00:02:57 Wow, you have me beat. Wow.
Alycia Vail 00:02:59 But I went to a magnet school, so it was also like a small town and then a smaller school in a small town. So that's why I would say, like, mine was extremely small, like the other people. They probably had like hundreds of students.
Tyson Mutrux 00:03:10 But. Yeah. And you said you went to you were a legal assistant before you went to law school. Yes. So why that's that's something honestly, for some reason, I never thought that that was the thing to do. So how did you know to do that? Do you think that that that helps you where you are now when it comes to running your firm?
Alycia Vail 00:03:27 Absolutely. So I actually got started in the legal world doing Mock Trial when I was in high school.
Alycia Vail 00:03:32 And so that really helped out a lot. And so after doing Mock Trial, I knew I wanted to be a lawyer, but I being the Type-A personality that I am, I wanted more experience as much as I could bring forth. Because what if I didn't want to do that? What if I actually couldn't handle it? What if I didn't like it? So in college, I used to let people know what my goals were and things like that. And then there happened to be an opening for a legal assistant and one of my teacher's husband's firms.
Tyson Mutrux 00:03:54 Yeah. Do you remember your first day?
Alycia Vail 00:03:56 Oh, gosh. No. I know I was nervous. I remember, like, thanking them for accepting, you know, like giving me the job offer, but I don't remember my first day. So that is funny, but I know I never mind, I do, because they surprise me with, like, a little care package and everything. So I had like my little coffee mug, my notebook and everything like that.
Alycia Vail 00:04:13 My own desk. I was it was a big deal for a college student, you know, to be able to be in that space.
Tyson Mutrux 00:04:19 Yeah. Are there any moments that you ever reflect back on from that experience where you're like, oh, that was so awesome.
Alycia Vail 00:04:26 Yeah. So many. Speaking of mock trial, I'm actually the vice chair of the high school mock trial committee now. Oh very cool. Yeah. Like, I just anytime I did something that did like that was meaningful and impactful, I want to give back in that way. And in working in Dalton for my first legal assistant job was when I had to drive to the courthouse to get things file stamped. We didn't have electronic filing at the time, so I really got to know from the ground floor what it was like to work in the legal field. And then once I moved to Atlanta, I became an intern at a law firm while I was in law school. And then I became their legal assistant and then later on, their lawyer.
Alycia Vail 00:05:01 So, like, it definitely gave me the the footing to be able to handle any job in the legal field and especially as a lawyer.
Tyson Mutrux 00:05:08 We do have some law students that listen to this. I wonder what advice would you have for them? Because there are a lot of people that just they go to law school because they think that that's what they're supposed to do. Do you have any advice for people like that or maybe before that point, they're they're not quite to the point where they're or maybe they are in law school. Right. And they just don't have that experience. Do you have any advice to them on what they should maybe do?
Alycia Vail 00:05:30 Yeah, absolutely. So the first thing I would say is don't do it. No I'm just kidding. But I would say like if you have any idea or a thought of something different that you would like to do that you would like to explore, I would say explore everything, because in the legal field, like it takes a lot out of you and you want to be able to enjoy what you do.
Alycia Vail 00:05:47 So that's one. So that's also why I got as much experience as I did. Reach out to lawyers around you. Reach out to your your teachers to see if they have internship opportunities, or know of other former students or the alumni program that would allow for that. So like my school allows for mentorship programs. So I have student mentors that I work with and that I offer, you know, summer internships to going forward. And so because people did that for me, I want to be able to do that. If you're already in law school and you're not sure they have externship opportunities where you can basically take a class, but instead of going to school, you're going to an internship and you're just logging those hours there. So I would definitely recommend trying at least three different practice areas to intern with or to work with for summer positions, because your interests may change. You know, you never know exactly what type of law you want to go into. I thought I would do international corporate law, but really, family law was always my calling.
Tyson Mutrux 00:06:38 That's funny because I was I want to ask you about your if you had any misconceptions about being a lawyer because I before I went to law school, I worked in State Farm Insurance as a fire claims rep, and remember when I left it was like we had a we had a really good work environment and the they had taken some Yellow Pages ads. Oh, and taken and cut out a picture of me and stuck it on the Yellow Pages ads. And they made a bunch of jokes about ambulance chasers and all that. And I going into law school, I was like, I will never be an injury lawyer. I'm an injury lawyer now. But yeah, because I had all these misconceptions and misperceptions about what that actually meant. Yeah. And then my first, I guess, was my second internship in law school, I loved it. I was like, wow. So you're actually now you're you're actually helping people. That's what you're doing. You're fighting against these big insurance companies. It completely shattered what I thought about when it comes to that.
Tyson Mutrux 00:07:30 And so was there anything and I'm specifically talking about that, that first job as a legal assistant. Did that help kill any misperceptions that maybe that you had about being a lawyer?
Alycia Vail 00:07:43 I'm trying to think because I think it's just scarier than you would think. And you would think that, okay, by the time I become a lawyer, like, you know, we've got this in the bag. Everybody's extremely confident, right? Everybody knows exactly what they're doing. But then you realize, no, actually, everyone is still trying to figure it out. And at the end of the day, being a lawyer is tough because if you're before a jury or before the judge, then they still get the final decision. If you can't make it, you know, come to an agreement prior to that. So I think that like the law being the law and being the end all, be all is not really, you know, what you would think it is as a lawyer, but kind of going back to my first legal assistant job and in that firm, it was a general law firm, but we did still take on a lot more personal injury, estate planning and family law cases.
Alycia Vail 00:08:26 And I think that, like the common misconception that I had at first was just that it was just like money hungry situation, right? Like, all lawyers just want money and they're just going to charge up and everything's going to be crazy. But like, there are actual lawyers who really, truly care and like, will do everything they can to make sure that their clients can afford their services.
Tyson Mutrux 00:08:43 Yeah, No, it's. I met way more very good people that are lawyers than the opposite. Yeah. So it's it's one of those things where we're sort of, we're sort of our victim of ourselves, where we have sort of let it happen, I think to a certain extent. Yeah, but the vast majority of lawyers are just fantastic lawyers. I'm not the type, though, that I'm okay with a good lawyer joke. I don't know about you. Oh, no, I love it.
Alycia Vail 00:09:04 Yeah, give it to me. You know, like, that's that's perfectly fine. I think it's important to be able to laugh at yourself and to find joy in this job where you can.
Tyson Mutrux 00:09:11 So yeah, I was at a CLI one time, and it was it was so funny. There was a guy that was up at the front. It was like a a bar. It was like a Missouri Bar Association kind of an event. And he was up there like for like five, ten minutes ranting about how we shouldn't be, we shouldn't be laughing at lawyer jokes. I was like, wow, dude.
Alycia Vail 00:09:32 You take yourself too.
Tyson Mutrux 00:09:33 Seriously. No, no, not at all. All right, so let's talk about a veil. Right. So if you were to distill your work at a real firm into one core mission. What would you say drives you on a day to day basis?
Alycia Vail 00:09:49 Yeah, I was actually just kind of fine tuning it so it would be community and service.
Tyson Mutrux 00:09:54 Oh, so this is it was good timing.
Speaker 4 00:09:56 It was perfect. Perfect timing.
Tyson Mutrux 00:09:57 What made you think to to want to fine tune it?
Alycia Vail 00:10:00 Because, you know, they talk about, you know, I'm a new firm.
Alycia Vail 00:10:02 So they talk about like building your ideal client or your client avatar and then kind of what the message is, the brain message is out to our clients. And that is just kind of, at my core, who I am and what I seek out whenever I'm looking into other services. Why I went to the law school I went to, like why I engaged with the friends that I do. And so that is what I want to be able to present to my clients. And then my clients no longer are not always just, oh, my client. There's somebody who's in our community who could be a referral source for another client of mine or another friend or, you know, so I think that when you really make people community, like family type, I hate to say like like family, but at the same time, I feel like your chosen family is your community, and I think that it's really good to have people you can lean on. So yeah, so that's what it would be.
Tyson Mutrux 00:10:44 So why those words though? I mean, so it was community and service service.
Tyson Mutrux 00:10:48 So let's start with service. Yes. So why and then how are how are you able to fulfill that through a veil.
Alycia Vail 00:10:57 So a part of it is one we we practice where we do family law state planning and personal injury. So those are just like our basic service areas. But then within that we also offer within our Georgia Peach Collective, a referral source referral network for our clients. So if you need a dentist, you need a hairstylist, you need a plumber. Like we have these connections for our clients. So that's where it ties in the service and community part.
Tyson Mutrux 00:11:20 Sure. I think I think it's a really cool idea. Like we're like your clients, like your community is kind of coming to you to find the best options for things. And I'm going to come back to that in a second, but avail. I want to make sure people know about this. So that's an acronym. Yes. So what does it what does it stand for.
Alycia Vail 00:11:37 So. Well, it actually is my name, so it's me.
Alycia Vail 00:11:40 So Alicia Vale Taylor. But also to avail like, you know. So as if you are prevailing especially in these legal sources. So like we're going to give you all of the resources that you need to be able to avail. And we're also available.
Tyson Mutrux 00:11:51 I like it. It's very well, I think it's really cool because like you combined parts of your name and I think it's not something you see very often. So it's pretty cool. Okay. So the whole idea like how would you differentiate between Georgia Peach Collective and the Avail firm?
Alycia Vail 00:12:07 So the Georgia Peach Collective is strictly our referral network. And so that's everybody who we network with just on a daily basis what we're doing here, but also providing just resources to our clients but also to our referral network. So it's like a mixture of things. Like it's just like a circular situation of okay, so now my financial planner needs a dentist, you know, that type of thing so they can connect on that way they also can connect in different service areas that they have or different areas of Georgia.
Alycia Vail 00:12:33 And then it goes even further because now I've got doctors or chiropractors that I can refer my personal injury clients to and vice versa. And so it just really is just like the Georgia Peach Collective is the full networking source. Just the 100 list is what they call it sometimes, right? Yeah. And then the avail firm strictly is about our legal services.
Tyson Mutrux 00:12:50 So how does someone get become a part of the collective.
Alycia Vail 00:12:53 So great question one. They would contact me or any of my team members to let me know that they want to be a part of the collective, and then we will give them their tiered package lists that they can choose from. So therefore they can be a part of networking, you know, community events. They can be a part of the online community that we have. They can be a part of, you know, traveling or giving speeches or, you know, being a part of the podcast or doing webinars with us because I think what is really important. You know, they say knowledge is power.
Alycia Vail 00:13:18 It's like cheeky but so serious in our field, especially with family law, so many areas of their life are touched or needed or affected by them getting a divorce, by them getting, you know, child support or whatever it may be.
Tyson Mutrux 00:13:32 I hit the microphone all the time.
Alycia Vail 00:13:33 So No no, no. I'm, like, the only person over here talking my hands like, hold myself.
Tyson Mutrux 00:13:37 I've learned to force myself to do it, even though, you know, like, you should talk with your hands, because actually, people, it actually makes people like you more. I don't know if you knew.
Alycia Vail 00:13:44 That's interesting. I didn't know that I have lots of fruit.
Tyson Mutrux 00:13:46 But I've, like, forced myself to kind of, like, not move them.
Alycia Vail 00:13:49 But, be chill.
Tyson Mutrux 00:13:50 But I want to ask you. So the package, the packages, I find it interesting. Okay. Is a couple, two part question. is the collective a subsidiary of the veil firm or vice versa? And so just unclear.
Tyson Mutrux 00:14:05 People are paying to be part of the, the group, the collective.
Alycia Vail 00:14:08 If you are part of that collective, yes. It is like a membership group. And so then there's different tiers based off of the membership. You know what that you want. We also have very exclusive things for the collective. So it's actually our wedding planner who became like our go to travel planner. And so she has ideas for us to be able to not eventually take it to international trips, you know, with our collective. But right now we're just doing local things in order to, you know, just make sure that one we're supporting our local community is giving back. Maybe they want to be a part of the collective going forward, but also just to pour into these people who are giving the such service and great service to our communities.
Tyson Mutrux 00:14:42 I love it so, but is one a subsidiary of the other?
Alycia Vail 00:14:45 Yes.
Tyson Mutrux 00:14:45 Sorry.
Alycia Vail 00:14:45 So the Georgia Peach Collective, so everything Georgia Peach related essentially is like a subsidiary of the avail firm.
Tyson Mutrux 00:14:52 Okay. The reason I'm asking is yes. So I had done an episode, I don't know, a month or so ago about different ways of making money for your firm. This wasn't one of them. And I wish I would have actually done this interview beforehand, because I think it's a really cool idea where you have created this way of finding more revenue for your firm. And what's super clever about it is, is that you're benefiting. So it's like you are you have a network paying you to then benefit you and your clients. So I think it's it's amazing. It's a very clever idea. Thanks. Yeah.
Alycia Vail 00:15:25 It's fun. I never thought about it like, it's like I haven't gotten that kind of feedback, but I like that. Yeah. It's good.
Tyson Mutrux 00:15:31 Yeah. Did the idea where did it come from? Where? Where's the. How did this originate? I think it's a brilliant idea.
Alycia Vail 00:15:36 Well, it's so funny. I mean, I've always wanted. And I've worked at different firms where they talked about, like, concierge lists and things like that.
Alycia Vail 00:15:43 And so I've always heard of it, but I've never actually seen it put in practice. And it was something when I started my firm, I knew for sure that I wanted to put it in practice.
Tyson Mutrux 00:15:50 Yeah. Okay. Well, that's very cool. Do your clients pay to get access to that list or just by being the client? They have access to it?
Alycia Vail 00:15:58 Exactly. Just by being a client, they have access to the list.
Tyson Mutrux 00:16:01 Be very interesting. I don't know how I'd feel about it, but it'd be very interesting if you could find a way for the clients to pay for access to the list.
Alycia Vail 00:16:07 I mean, you know what? It actually could be, in a sense, of a subscription. Yeah. So a yearly or monthly or a yearly subscription to the collective. Now, now see look at their.
Tyson Mutrux 00:16:17 And they get discounted rates. Exactly.
Alycia Vail 00:16:19 Of course. Definitely. And that's what I tell the people who are in the collective. So I may give if you're a part of the collective and you need any of the available services, you get a discount.
Alycia Vail 00:16:27 But I don't expect them to give my clients a discount. However, if I was to do an annual, subscription, I think that that would make sense. And then that is their discount.
Tyson Mutrux 00:16:36 So I do have a question. Sure. So you have the three niche areas. And are you practicing each of those practice areas? Yes. Okay. And then you have the the Georgia Peach. Do you ever worry that you're being pulled in too many different directions?
Alycia Vail 00:16:50 Absolutely. Absolutely. And so every time I get a chance to try to figure out cool, like, what to power down or what to, you know, kind of what is it? What is the word? Of course it's going to. I can't even think of it because I don't do it well enough. But whenever you pass, work off to others.
Tyson Mutrux 00:17:04 Yeah. A delegate.
Alycia Vail 00:17:05 There we go. Delegate. So, yes. So I have been working diligently on how to delegate in order to not be feeling like I'm pulled in so many different directions.
Alycia Vail 00:17:15 And I've also slowly scaled it, and I slowly. I mean, I did start my firm at the end of August, but in my mind I'm slowly scaling it because I'm like pacing it out, because the other thing that we do have that we just started was our podcast for the firm. And so that one's called Georgia Peach Sessions. Nice.
Tyson Mutrux 00:17:31 Yeah. Okay. Tell me more about that.
Alycia Vail 00:17:32 So it's actually have you heard of or have you seen Meghan Markle Sussex Show on Netflix?
Tyson Mutrux 00:17:38 I have not, but I've heard really terrible things.
Speaker 5 00:17:40 I can't believe people.
Alycia Vail 00:17:41 Are trying to be haters.
Tyson Mutrux 00:17:42 So here's the thing. I'm not hating. I'm just telling you what I've heard so that I am sure whatever. Based on what I've heard, I'm sure whatever you are doing is substantially better to compared to what I have heard.
Alycia Vail 00:17:54 Well, it's fantastic to me, it's fantastic. It's like the type of escapism that you want because it's no drama and it is just fun. Like easy ways to learn how to do things in your daily life.
Alycia Vail 00:18:05 And that's what I that's the way I take it. So for my podcast, like that's the vibe I wanted was fun friends, family, like people who are really a part of my inner circle, getting a chance to not only share their skill sets with others. So like, I'll just give you like a snippet of one of my podcasts. So it's called like it was supposed to be called Cupcakes in Custody, but then we just switched it at the last second.
Speaker 5 00:18:25 But because.
Tyson Mutrux 00:18:26 That's kind.
Speaker 5 00:18:26 Of fun.
Alycia Vail 00:18:26 Yeah. So my friend is a mental health therapist, so she'll come back for cupcakes and custody.
Speaker 5 00:18:30 Okay.
Alycia Vail 00:18:30 But for this one she just did like mind over matter. And she's also a baker, though. So she made us Georgia peach cupcakes, which was like. It was just like a vanilla based cupcake with Georgia. What's it called? The peach cobbler.
Speaker 5 00:18:44 Topping. Oh. So it.
Alycia Vail 00:18:46 Was fantastic. So the whole part is to, like, not only highlight what she does on her, like, side job.
Alycia Vail 00:18:51 Right, but to also highlight what she does in her day to day job, which is a mental health therapist. And then we talk about how that works well for entrepreneurs, as well as people who are going through legal battles, as well as how parents can, you know, deal and communicate with their kids. So that's what the cupcakes and custody one will be about. And my goal for that one is to like, have us like decorate the cupcakes together. Like doing something different than just sitting here and talking like it's always fine. Yeah, but I feel like it could be fun to be interactive.
Tyson Mutrux 00:19:17 We can gossip about shows like.
Alycia Vail 00:19:19 Like.
Tyson Mutrux 00:19:20 What's the name of the Meghan Markle.
Alycia Vail 00:19:22 With love, Megan. Okay, so it's so good.
Tyson Mutrux 00:19:24 I want to ask you about this.
Alycia Vail 00:19:24 I want to make. I'm gonna make every single thing she made.
Tyson Mutrux 00:19:26 I think this is gonna help your show. Okay. This is why I'm asking you. Okay. So the the critique, the main critique I've heard.
Tyson Mutrux 00:19:33 Okay. Is that there's things that she's clearly doing that she doesn't know what she's doing. And it's, like, clearly very fake and, like, staged. That's what I've heard. It's like all staged. And it's like there's, like, I heard something about her wearing all white and like.
Alycia Vail 00:19:47 Oh my gosh. Yeah, I did see that. And people like, yeah, sometimes people do wear white in the kitchen. Some people are not natural.
Tyson Mutrux 00:19:52 And so she was like picking some fruit and I don't remember. That's what I heard like strawberries. Is that what it was?
Alycia Vail 00:19:57 I mean, I know for sure she had some strawberries that she picked.
Tyson Mutrux 00:20:00 Did you get that perception, too? No. Okay.
Alycia Vail 00:20:02 Everything about it was genuine, authentic, kind, nice. Just like, I don't know. But, I mean, I guess because I also just. I've. I watched her before the whole Prince Harry stuff. Right? I followed her initial blog, The Tea. So I think that I just kind of have a different perception of her, because that same thing happened with one of my other friends in a group text like one friend watched it.
Alycia Vail 00:20:21 She loved it. I'm like, I loved it, and the other friend is like, no, someone said she's trying to copy Rachael Ray or whatever. I'm like, oh my gosh, I don't care. But I want to host a tea party with my friends and I hope I can do it on the Georgia Peach sessions. But like some of the little things that she made, because I think they're just cute, cute ways to elevate your food and then just talking with people learning.
Tyson Mutrux 00:20:40 So the reason why I said that might help because it's like as long as whatever you're doing is genuine, like that's what matters. That's all I was talking about beforehand. Like, not have the podcasters voice, like having conversations like we've been doing, right? Yeah. Because people they know, like they they can sense whenever people are not being real. Like. Yeah. So that's as long as you're being genuine with everything. I think that that's.
Alycia Vail 00:21:00 And I.
Tyson Mutrux 00:21:00 Think.
Alycia Vail 00:21:01 One thing about me that I think about me that I love, but like, but really is like I almost have like an inability to not be authentic.
Alycia Vail 00:21:09 And I hate that at times because I'm like, oh no, this is not a good look. And then other times it it works because everybody who works with me on the show, so like my producer for the podcast and for all of my social media. He's one of my best friends from law school, and he chose not to be a lawyer, which is like, good for you. This is exactly what I say. Like, you know, do your things. And then everyone who I had as a guest for the first show, and what I hope for the first season will be actual, genuine close friends of mine, and then the next season be people who have continued to get to know through the collective. So that way people can see how, you know, just true and genuine it is. So the first was a mental health therapist friend. The other was my coaching and consulting friend for just like wellness, mental health and wellness coaching. You can see how important I think that is.
Alycia Vail 00:21:50 Yeah.
Tyson Mutrux 00:21:50 Yeah.
Alycia Vail 00:21:50 It's good. The other was my husband. so, you know, to give people a little insight. And then the other was, a legal assistant who I helped promote to a paralegal. Oh, okay. And so we talked about sisterhood and the law, and so. Yeah.
Tyson Mutrux 00:22:03 So you, you know, health and wellness is important. Yes. Right. So why is it so important to you?
Alycia Vail 00:22:09 Because I know that your body can shut down and you won't be able to do anything if you're not focused on that. And a lot of times it really does start with the mental side of it before it goes to the physical and being able to just like, pair those two together in order to have the strength to carry on. Like, there are some days where I'm just shut down because I have overspent. Essentially on the mental and physical side of things.
Tyson Mutrux 00:22:31 Is there has there was there some sort of event that happened or what? I guess, what led you to that? I mean, it's like one of those things where like it's I've had this sort of come to this realization over time that, you know, mental health is really, really important.
Tyson Mutrux 00:22:43 Obviously, physical health is really, really important. But I think when we're younger, we sort of we discount how important it is. Take it for granted. Are you kidding me? Yeah. So I wonder what led you to, like. Okay, I gotta get serious about this.
Alycia Vail 00:22:57 A mixture of things one. You know, you go to the doctor, right? And, you know, after you over 30. And, I mean, I'm only freshly over 30, but still over 30. Yeah. All of a sudden, everything starts to hurt and all these things come up on the test. You know, there's my blood pressure and cholesterol and stress and anxiety. And honestly, that was really it for me. It was like the anxiety and stress of it all really taking a toll on my body. And then once I started my own firm and it being virtual and I'm sitting for days on end not moving. All of a sudden not working out because I'm thinking I don't have to workout every day anyway.
Alycia Vail 00:23:30 So then the number on the scale continues to go up, and then overall health numbers are dropping and or elevating whichever one. On the negative side. Yeah. And so that really was just like my wake up call in general, because I felt like I was doing my body a disservice. And I forgot that, you know, you have to pour into yourself before you can pour into others. I just kind of kept thinking I could go, yeah, like coasting.
Tyson Mutrux 00:23:53 Like when you're on an airplane and the masks drop down, you got to put the mask on yourself before you can help.
Alycia Vail 00:23:57 Yourself, literally. So it's like, okay, I'm in bed, I can't move. My husband is like, you're not getting up to do anything. You just need to lay there, you know? And it was kind of like, okay, maybe I do need to, like, have a plan on health and wellness in order to do this. Entrepreneur, you.
Tyson Mutrux 00:24:10 Know. So have you ever done, like, those massive blood tests test where you can like, do all like check everything.
Tyson Mutrux 00:24:15 Like what food you should be eating, which ones you know.
Alycia Vail 00:24:17 I want to do that. No, I.
Tyson Mutrux 00:24:19 Just I just paid for one. I've not done the test yet, so it's like function. I like I like listening to modern wisdom and like, they have like a special deal where you can get it through them, like 4.99 or something like that. So I bought one for me and one for my wife. So we're going to do that. And they they do it all through quest. Okay. So you have quest right. Yeah. We're like they're all over the place. So you can go to any of the labs and then they just draw like 11 or 12 vials of blood. And then they tell you all these things about which I need to do. I'm very excited about doing it.
Alycia Vail 00:24:45 Yeah, definitely. Like that's something I prefer. Like I like to know all the things and then it makes it so much easier to care for yourself.
Tyson Mutrux 00:24:51 Well it's crazy. Good luck going to my.
Tyson Mutrux 00:24:52 So my mom, she just happened by coincidence? Yeah. Like a week before I paid for function. She's like, yeah, I just went to the stock shit to go drive 20 minutes away from where? Where we live. And because you go to like, a regular doctor and they're like, oh, you don't need to get any blood tests like that. It's insane. I like to yeah, yeah, I want to get I want to get my blood. But they, they may they may do it, but they're not going to analyze it for you. Yeah. So she ended up finding a doctor. It's like 20 minutes away. Yeah. She had to drive out there 20 miles away. And, it just it's frustrating.
Alycia Vail 00:25:23 Definitely because I mean, I was I was at the doctor and then I asked them, like my blood type or whatever, because I'm like, you know what? I actually don't know it. That's interesting. Yeah. And then they said, okay, well, we're going to send this information to a different, you know, Quest Diagnostics or whatever.
Alycia Vail 00:25:36 And then you have to get it from them. Oh, interesting. Like okay.
Tyson Mutrux 00:25:39 Do you know, do you know what it is now. No, no.
Alycia Vail 00:25:43 It wasn't that serious at that point.
Tyson Mutrux 00:25:44 My mind is oh positive. I know that. Yes, I, I do, because it's the opposite of the really good, not the opposite of the good, but the one that's really, really good. Like. Oh, negative.
Alycia Vail 00:25:52 Yeah. Yeah. Like no one's going to hunt you down. Exactly, exactly.
Tyson Mutrux 00:25:55 Got it. Exactly. Right. Yeah. So let's talk about, the virtual firm and what, what was the the reason behind wanting to do a remote?
Alycia Vail 00:26:08 So one it was to be able to service more people. because not everyone needs to see you to, you know, handle their will or to get a name change. You know, and honestly, even a divorce, like, there are so many things that we can do virtually now, especially since Covid, you know, that was awful and traumatic.
Alycia Vail 00:26:24 But it also gave our court systems these opportunities to kind of lean into the virtual side of things. So where they do that, we will make sure that we offer everything to our clients. So that way their lives are not fully interrupted. Right? They have to now stop, start what they're doing and get off of work and do X, Y, and Z just to come meet with us. They can do a quick meeting online. They can do a phone call, zoom, whatever they prefer. We can handle business. We can talk on the client portal, exchange documents, get everything filed, send to them, and it's done.
Tyson Mutrux 00:26:52 Do you ever run into any issues because you're remote?
Alycia Vail 00:26:55 Yes. Well, especially in the beginning, right. Because of, like, trying to find the right spot to meet clients. Because I didn't know that sometimes clients would just show up to wherever, you know.
Tyson Mutrux 00:27:04 The other world.
Alycia Vail 00:27:05 Yeah. And then they're like, I'm here. What's happening. I wanted to stop by and say something or do whatever, and it's like, oh, okay.
Alycia Vail 00:27:11 That's why we say by appointment only. Yeah, because we mean it because we're not going to be there. So I think sometimes that that's definitely been like.
Tyson Mutrux 00:27:18 So is this an address they found on the website.
Alycia Vail 00:27:20 So it is. So it is our Google website right.
Tyson Mutrux 00:27:22 For me. Yeah. Yeah. Okay.
Alycia Vail 00:27:24 For mail or by appointments.
Tyson Mutrux 00:27:25 Is it Atlanta address or is it like somewhere.
Alycia Vail 00:27:27 It is in Atlanta address. And so I felt really bad because someone drove like an hour away one time. Yeah. But no one told them they had an appointment in person.
Tyson Mutrux 00:27:34 We've had that before several times.
Alycia Vail 00:27:36 So it's like, oh no. So that or of course if people are because we have a really good Google SEO, which is awesome, but like they may be in Macon, they're like, well, you were the first one who popped up in Macon. So I want to meet with you in person today. And it's like, cool, but we can't do that today. We can certainly do it later.
Alycia Vail 00:27:51 If you're welcome to drive to Atlanta. You know, we don't have like, satellite offices everywhere. And I think that that could be something to look into, or at least meeting at courthouses in different places. There's something for people who want in person, but for the most part, everybody has been really good about it being virtual because they're like, oh no, actually, this saves me time and money.
Tyson Mutrux 00:28:07 So making how big is it? I don't know okay. Is it but is it. I'm assuming it's substantially smaller than Atlanta.
Alycia Vail 00:28:14 Yeah. Yeah, definitely. And it's like an hour and a half away maybe.
Tyson Mutrux 00:28:17 So the reason why I'm asking is because we've got a Saint Louis office and a Columbia office. Okay. Saint Louis is way bigger than Columbia. Okay. And what we've noticed is we have a lot more drop ins in Columbia, a lot more clients in Columbia that want to meet in person. Saint Louis, they couldn't care like they like. Please do.
Alycia Vail 00:28:34 Not try to.
Tyson Mutrux 00:28:34 See me. Yeah. Don't they? Like. We barely want to talk to you. It's. It's a handle on my case. And we'll talk to you. And you have a check for me kind of thing. Columbia's not like that. It's just completely different. So I wonder if you have a similar experience.
Alycia Vail 00:28:46 I mean, a little bit. I will say, thankfully, our clients really find me and my team personable enough to where it works out that they don't really feel like they're missing out with in person. And then again, we do offer it if they want to. It's just by appointment and then it is going to be here in Atlanta for now, unless like I happen to be traveling, they're all ready for court.
Tyson Mutrux 00:29:05 Have you ever thought about not taking any clients that want to meet in person or like you have, like, some sort of standing policy?
Alycia Vail 00:29:13 No, not really, I guess, because honestly, it just hasn't come up yet. Like because. But also I think it would make sense.
Alycia Vail 00:29:18 We probably would reject them if they're like, well, absolutely not. I want to meet with her in person and she needs to come to me. Well, then it would be like, well, unfortunately we can't do that.
Tyson Mutrux 00:29:26 So let me let me tell you a little trick. We we've stopped taking any client that does not have an email address.
Alycia Vail 00:29:33 Oh, okay. That's. Yeah.
Tyson Mutrux 00:29:34 And what we found was if you don't have an email address, you are far more likely to want to meet in person. And it doesn't really fit in with what we. And we're, we're hybrid. So we're we're okay. We have we are remote. We have remote employees and we have in-person employees. I go to the office. Yeah, we have two physical offices. But even with that, we it's still with the way we're set up. We're I mean, we've been paperless since 2010. Like we. So it's it just does not fit in with, like the way we update our clients, all of that.
Tyson Mutrux 00:30:04 If you don't have an email address, it, it just creates a whole different headache because it just doesn't fit in. So. Have you ever thought about and maybe not email address? Or are there other things that maybe you could do that that are similar? We're like, okay, let's weed out clients that way.
Alycia Vail 00:30:17 To a degree. Because yes, I mean, it makes it difficult if they don't have an email address or if they're just not willing at all to have any sort of meetings in person. I mean, virtually, because like, at least for our initial meeting, we try to make that virtual because it just makes the most sense.
Tyson Mutrux 00:30:30 Or is it over the phone or is it on the on the computer.
Alycia Vail 00:30:33 Phone or zoom, whichever one they prefer. And then they just have to have at least somebody who's willing to help them. Right. Like we. So thankfully we have a lot of people who have kids who will help them with the technology. So that works out. But then other times they're just like I said, sometimes people just show up.
Alycia Vail 00:30:46 So I should probably have a policy for the people who just show up to just.
Speaker 6 00:30:50 Go ahead and get.
Tyson Mutrux 00:30:51 Cut.
Alycia Vail 00:30:51 Off because one if they just show up to our I'm switching everything now, but if they had just shown up to our previous like mailing situation, they would have missed out on our really nice office that's on the Beltline that you can bring your dog to. That's that was always a reason for me to go. So it's not. So our firm is still virtual, but we have like our co-working space which is at industrious in on the Beltline. So it's similar to what we work with.
Tyson Mutrux 00:31:14 Different industries are cool.
Alycia Vail 00:31:15 Yeah, I love it. They have snacks and then again they allow doggies.
Tyson Mutrux 00:31:19 I do wonder which one was first. I knew about industrious before we worked, but I don't know which one was first.
Alycia Vail 00:31:24 Yeah. Me neither. I always, I always heard about WeWork first, though, before industrious. So I don't know if it just took a while to get down to Georgia compared to because I know, like they have it in Texas and Arizona.
Tyson Mutrux 00:31:34 They've been Saint Louis. They've had them in Saint Louis since, I mean, way back when. I mean, like I'm talking like probably like 2012.
Alycia Vail 00:31:41 Yeah, I love how they do business. And so like that's been our so we switched to that. But it just took us a while to figure out where we wanted to be to where we would regularly meet with clients.
Tyson Mutrux 00:31:51 I like the way they kind of rethink things, because it's and I think this is the business model where they go into old buildings and kind of they kind of accept the bones as they are and then like put nice furnishings in there, but it doesn't seem like they spend nearly as much as what, like we work had to.
Speaker 6 00:32:07 Probably.
Alycia Vail 00:32:07 I don't know, the one on the Beltline is insanely nice, so I'm not quite sure. They apparently shot like a marvel scene there. Oh, really? Yeah. Like insane.
Speaker 6 00:32:15 Is it a no no no.
Alycia Vail 00:32:16 You know what they were they were considering sorry, it was on the list, but they didn't they didn't actually make the cut.
Tyson Mutrux 00:32:22 So is that in a new building though, or is it an old building?
Alycia Vail 00:32:25 I have no idea. It looks new.
Speaker 6 00:32:26 Okay.
Alycia Vail 00:32:26 Everything looks new and nice and pristine. I really chose it because of the security purposes for law firms. Of course, like that just is huge. And then obviously the other part is being dog friendly.
Speaker 6 00:32:35 But yeah.
Tyson Mutrux 00:32:36 Because you do estate planning, you're I mean, you need a notary every once in a while, right? So how do you deal with things like that.
Alycia Vail 00:32:41 We have a travel notary. And then we also contact other travel notaries in other cities whenever we have clients in other places.
Tyson Mutrux 00:32:48 Do you ever use anything like notarize?
Alycia Vail 00:32:50 No, but I think that must be like an online now.
Tyson Mutrux 00:32:52 It's called proof.
Speaker 6 00:32:53 Now. Oh, yes. Yeah. Wait, wait.
Alycia Vail 00:32:54 You're talking about.
Speaker 6 00:32:55 Proof?
Tyson Mutrux 00:32:56 Notarize used to be so. Proof used to be notarized.
Alycia Vail 00:32:58 But proof is now. So we use proof for service. But I didn't realize.
Speaker 6 00:33:02 That.
Tyson Mutrux 00:33:02 They do now. They notarized.
Speaker 6 00:33:04 Yeah. Wow. Okay.
Alycia Vail 00:33:05 Fantastic.
Speaker 6 00:33:06 Well, yeah.
Tyson Mutrux 00:33:06 So I wonder if proof, but notarized, I don't know.
Speaker 6 00:33:09 They had to have. Right.
Tyson Mutrux 00:33:10 But we use. So it used to be called if you Google notarized.
Speaker 6 00:33:13 Yeah it'll.
Tyson Mutrux 00:33:14 Come. And actually if you Google notarized a bunch of notaries will come up and notarized. Won't come up. You have to say yeah, remote notary or something like that. Right. Memorize. That's probably why that changes.
Speaker 6 00:33:22 To.
Tyson Mutrux 00:33:23 Proof. Yeah. But proof is we we use proof. It's really.
Speaker 6 00:33:27 Good.
Alycia Vail 00:33:27 I love it for service. I didn't think about it for notary. So I need to look into all the other services.
Speaker 6 00:33:31 They have then.
Tyson Mutrux 00:33:32 So we were we we used to use we if we didn't have if they were not someone that was going to come into the office to have it notarized in the in person, we would send out a mobile notary, which honestly, the price is actually about the same.
Tyson Mutrux 00:33:46 It's. But we found it was getting a little awkward with clients. We were scheduling it for clients with with proof they can schedule it themselves. Yep. They could. I could send you a document right now, and you could go whenever you want. You could go right now if you wanted. No appointment, and you'd have it notarized in minutes.
Speaker 6 00:34:01 It's pretty good.
Alycia Vail 00:34:02 Nice. I love proof in general, just like the way that they handle everything service wise. And even if they need an A, what is it that now the affidavit of service. But the motion to appoint. You know that they'll make sure that they get all that information out. Oh that's awesome. Yeah. So they're really good on that and that side of things. And then steno is supposed to be good for depositions and whatnot. Transcripts.
Tyson Mutrux 00:34:21 Really? Tell me more about that.
Alycia Vail 00:34:23 Well, now that's all I know.
Speaker 6 00:34:24 Okay. Okay.
Alycia Vail 00:34:26 S t e n o.
Tyson Mutrux 00:34:28 And, like, they're like.
Speaker 6 00:34:29 It's.
Alycia Vail 00:34:29 Online.
Tyson Mutrux 00:34:30 Like.
Speaker 6 00:34:30 Remote.
Tyson Mutrux 00:34:31 Interesting. There was another one and I'm drawing a blank on the name of it. I thought it was kind of a silly name, but they, they use something like Guardians of the depositions what they call them. They weren't they were not core reporters. They were not certified court reporters.
Speaker 6 00:34:46 Interesting.
Tyson Mutrux 00:34:46 Which was really. Yeah.
Speaker 6 00:34:48 I thought the same thing.
Alycia Vail 00:34:49 Why?
Speaker 6 00:34:50 What?
Tyson Mutrux 00:34:50 I don't remember the reasoning, but the apparently they said with like, you know, within all the court rules they were it was legit. But I mean, I.
Speaker 6 00:34:58 Don't know, I don't know, I don't know.
Alycia Vail 00:35:00 Like this is not the time to risk.
Speaker 6 00:35:01 It. So interesting.
Tyson Mutrux 00:35:03 It was I posted about the one time in like a court reporter like said something about because I thought it was at first I was pretty cool. And then I looked and I was.
Speaker 6 00:35:09 Like, I don't know, maybe not.
Tyson Mutrux 00:35:10 I don't know, you know? So I wonder, how difficult is it marketing for the three different practice areas?
Alycia Vail 00:35:15 So it is interesting, right? Just like trying to run it.
Alycia Vail 00:35:18 So what we decided to do was kind of take a step back on marketing, on personal injury, because that was not our number one client intake situation just from opening. So we take personal injury cases as they come, but we're not necessarily like marketing to them. We'll still do my social media marketing. Like we'll still give people insight and information. Let them know we do that, that we practice that. And then whenever I meet up with my other personal injury friends or, you know, the larger firms or smaller firms, someone who doesn't want to litigate or someone who wants, you know, who just has too many cases, then we'll take those on. So that's kind of how we've helped a little bit when it comes to family lore that naturally has just come. I've been doing it now for over ten years, even though I've only been barred for five. But because I started, you know, as a legal assistant before, I've just been involved in family law for over ten years. And then similarly with estate planning.
Alycia Vail 00:36:03 But we've been trying to push that one more because I don't I feel like a lot of people just don't know about estate planning as much and like what they could use, what they could need, you know, and why. It's not just for wealthy people and things like that. So I've really been trying to educate people on the estate planning side and making sure my close friends and family all have that taken care of. So that way they don't have to worry about their loved ones later. But family law is just kind of it is just a beast. Unfortunately people, there's always going to be litigation going on with family law. So it's almost, almost no marketing outside of Google.
Tyson Mutrux 00:36:31 Yeah.
Speaker 6 00:36:32 How do you keep.
Tyson Mutrux 00:36:33 How do you keep track or how do you have systems and processes for all three because they're so drastically.
Speaker 6 00:36:39 Different?
Alycia Vail 00:36:40 Yeah. So I mean thankfully our case management system is really versatile. So we use Cleo. And so it and that's the one that allows it automatically syncs up with proof and with steno.
Alycia Vail 00:36:49 And so like those things already are tracked within our system, so we don't have to keep going to like opening all these different things. They even have matter snail which is a mail situation. So where we can we don't have to go to the post office to mail anything. We just do it online.
Tyson Mutrux 00:37:03 Oh that's nice. Yeah, I've never heard of that. I've heard a lot of lots of them. So that's when for sending letters. Interesting. What about your mail? How do you handle your mail?
Alycia Vail 00:37:11 So right now the mail does come. And that's something I would love to figure out a better system for.
Tyson Mutrux 00:37:16 Because mail Earth class, mail air class. Earth.
Speaker 6 00:37:18 Earth class. So.
Alycia Vail 00:37:19 Okay, I saw.
Speaker 6 00:37:20 That.
Alycia Vail 00:37:21 But I wasn't. I got nervous.
Speaker 6 00:37:23 Because.
Alycia Vail 00:37:23 Are they the ones who will open and scan it and send it.
Speaker 6 00:37:25 To you?
Alycia Vail 00:37:26 Yeah. See the confidentiality part of it? It just made me nervous. What was there? Confidentiality.
Tyson Mutrux 00:37:31 What's the difference between having, like, a contractor come in and doing that versus probably not.
Alycia Vail 00:37:36 And that makes it. That makes it better. Easier?
Tyson Mutrux 00:37:38 Yeah. I mean, they can even deposit checks like we don't do that. We don't have them do that.
Speaker 6 00:37:42 Don't go.
Tyson Mutrux 00:37:42 That far. We don't we don't have any checks. Go to the that office. We have Okay. You know, we. I mean, we just have we'd say go to the scanning center. And so it just goes and scans and it goes straight into a folder. And then we have, we have a VA that actually then goes and puts it into client files.
Alycia Vail 00:37:58 That would be beautiful. That's the one struggle right now. And then with that though, I'm trying to figure out how do you still have like your listed office. But then there's a mailing address separate. So is it that whenever you're filing things you just like how does it work.
Tyson Mutrux 00:38:13 Yeah. So good question. So on all of our pleadings we put the the scanning center okay.
Speaker 6 00:38:18 The Earth class mail.
Tyson Mutrux 00:38:19 Exactly. Which is they give you an actual they it was interesting.
Tyson Mutrux 00:38:22 They just switched us over. It used to be a P.O. Box, which I didn't like. And they they actually just switched it over to a real address. The problem. This is a good thing and a bad thing. It is. So our Clayton address, which was our Saint Louis address.
Speaker 6 00:38:34 Okay.
Tyson Mutrux 00:38:35 The mailing center address is a block away. So like.
Speaker 6 00:38:38 They're like oh.
Tyson Mutrux 00:38:38 Wow. So that is that could get confusing. Yeah. So we just make sure it's very, very clear in all of our email signatures and then on on the pleadings for mail only. Don't send checks all that, but that's okay. We for the most part, we only list that address. Okay. Is what we do. That's that's.
Speaker 6 00:38:53 How we.
Alycia Vail 00:38:53 Do. But then how do people show up?
Tyson Mutrux 00:38:55 Well, now we make sure it's very clear though, like for our clients, like, if we're, like of a depot or something, we just make sure we tell them which address it is and when it when it comes to defense firms, we make sure that, hey, this is the address our sales address.
Alycia Vail 00:39:06 And so and on Google same thing.
Speaker 6 00:39:08 It's just the.
Tyson Mutrux 00:39:09 Yeah we yeah the mailing address is not.
Speaker 6 00:39:11 On.
Tyson Mutrux 00:39:11 Google.
Speaker 6 00:39:11 On Google at all.
Tyson Mutrux 00:39:12 Okay. That's how we do it I the main reason why we use it is because we get so much mail.
Speaker 6 00:39:17 Yeah.
Tyson Mutrux 00:39:18 The scanning alone, it's worth it because it takes so much time.
Speaker 6 00:39:23 Yeah.
Tyson Mutrux 00:39:23 Because we get like, you know, you pleadings discovery, medical records like just so many things. And it's just so much to scan and it it's worth it by itself just for that.
Alycia Vail 00:39:33 That makes sense I mean thankfully we don't have like a large mail volume, which is why it's kind of been like low on the list of trying to figure out what to do about it. Yeah, but I also hate going to grab the mail and scanning it in, and especially when the scanner doesn't want to work with me today. You know what I mean? But my team with the remote and virtual, it's it's difficult for me sometimes to delegate when I want someone to go and check the mail or get it, because sometimes I'm just closer.
Alycia Vail 00:39:55 So it's just things I have to, like, figure out and you know what kinks work through.
Tyson Mutrux 00:40:00 If you were going to get rid of one of the practice areas, which would it be?
Alycia Vail 00:40:04 Probably p.I. It's not that, but it's hard to but I mean probably I in my mind I still would never like officially give it up. I would still just, we just wouldn't you know, market it.
Speaker 6 00:40:15 Why are you.
Tyson Mutrux 00:40:15 So why are you so attached to it?
Alycia Vail 00:40:17 because, I mean, I've done it before, I enjoy it. I think that it's sometimes a good break, too, from, like, my family law and estate planning. Yeah. type things. And I really like helping people in general. And I like the people that I've met. And the P.I. field, sometimes they've been, like, way nicer and way more enjoyable to work with on the on that side than it has been on my family law side of things.
Tyson Mutrux 00:40:37 So I have it just it's interesting. So early on in my career, I handled three family law matters.
Tyson Mutrux 00:40:45 It was really early and I was.
Speaker 6 00:40:46 Doing.
Alycia Vail 00:40:47 Absolutely.
Speaker 6 00:40:48 Never.
Tyson Mutrux 00:40:48 And how vicious they were. And then we had an injury case where there was a we filed the lawsuit against the husband. This is one of those things. The only time I've ever done this, it was just an interesting thing that we tried where there was a divorce component, too. So my buddy handled the divorce and then we handled the injury side of it. And because the, the, the husband was a very abusive. But he had he had money. That's why we that's really okay.
Speaker 6 00:41:14 Well let's try to make it work.
Tyson Mutrux 00:41:15 And I couldn't believe how nasty the other side was. It was like it it's a different like with pie. It is. It is mostly really good. Yeah. The other side. But family law. Oh, I don't know how you'll like. Why is it like that?
Alycia Vail 00:41:31 I do not know. And I'm. I feel like an alien sometimes outside of it. I'm like, I know I'm not, like, the only person who feels like this, but it's like the people who feel like it either get out of it, hurry up and get, you know, get out of it, or they just are passive.
Alycia Vail 00:41:45 and instead, like, I'm trying to, like, help make this a better field. And so I'm trying to do all of the niceties that you would normally do, like, hey, I'm gonna introduce myself in the case, hey, we're gonna try to work for these party's best interests. And if not the parties, then the children involved.
Speaker 6 00:41:58 Like.
Alycia Vail 00:41:58 Yeah, let's think about the kids. Because I actually got into family law because of my own family situation. My parents went through a divorce when I was like 12. So I got to see the justice system not be so just. And I wanted to help in that regard. And so now I get to see it on the adult side and help. And everybody doesn't have that same agenda, it seems. I don't know if it's just like a money driven thing, if it's an ego driven thing, I don't know. I would love to have more family law attorney friends. I have a good like just a group of people. However, in general, I've just continued to run across people who I can't understand, like they're pointing it.
Alycia Vail 00:42:34 It's like they have a personal stake in it or something. I don't.
Speaker 6 00:42:36 Know.
Tyson Mutrux 00:42:37 So it's weird to me. Is all of the family attorneys that I personally know are all nice, good people.
Alycia Vail 00:42:42 Yeah, but then they talk about everybody else who's awful.
Tyson Mutrux 00:42:45 But like all the my experience has been like the other side has been awful. And I, I wonder if like, do you all turn into a different human, you know, whenever you're dealing with each other?
Alycia Vail 00:42:54 I think so, and I think, you know, it depends on like how personal you take it. Because whenever I like, I love being the reasonable person in the room. And I realize other people don't care about being reasonable. And I think that that makes that difference. Or, you know, we have different opinions of what reasonable is or the law is just not on your side. So there's only so much you can do and someone's going to, you know, act up or showboat for their client because of it.
Tyson Mutrux 00:43:16 There is something about, I'm reading this book and they're talking about how judges the they will when like later in the day when they're tired. So let's say this is, we're you're in the middle of a jury trial, and you probably do you have is it bench tried cases in mostly. Yes. So let's let's say it's a bench dried case and you're, it's near the end of the day and you are the one moving to change something. Judges are far more likely to go with the status quo of whatever it is when they're tired at the end of the day. But like so if you knew if you know things like that.
Speaker 6 00:43:52 Yeah.
Tyson Mutrux 00:43:53 Like I feel like the, the bad attorneys, the ones, not the bad ones. The mean ones. The vile ones. Yeah. They'll take advantage of things like that. Whereas, like you or me, we might be like. Like you. Kind of like you would be a lot more reasonable. And you want to be reasonable to the judge.
Tyson Mutrux 00:44:10 But being reasonable is not a good.
Speaker 6 00:44:12 Thing, because.
Alycia Vail 00:44:12 Like, these people's lives are going to be changed forever to a degree. Like there's going, this is going to make an impact. And so I think about it like I take that part of it so seriously. And so therefore I'm going to try not to, you know, make any missteps. I'm going to try to, you know, engage with the other side in negotiations to try to settle it outside of court, because we never know what's going to happen with court. But you sometimes you just cannot do that and you just have to sit before the judge. Then the worst is when the judge thinks that both you and opposing counsel are just bickering and it's like, no, no, no, Your Honor.
Speaker 6 00:44:42 No. Yes.
Alycia Vail 00:44:43 No. They're like, both of y'all need to hush. And it's like, okay, so we're not going to.
Tyson Mutrux 00:44:47 That happened to me in December where the other side was being so ridiculous.
Speaker 6 00:44:52 Yeah.
Tyson Mutrux 00:44:52 And then he took it out on both of us. And like he said, you all go back into my jury room and you all go deal with everything. And like, yeah, I didn't do anything here. But I was like, yes, Your Honor.
Speaker 6 00:45:04 Like, it's of course. Oh, of course, yes.
Tyson Mutrux 00:45:05 But it what it does is I feel like it forces you to be unreasonable when ordinarily you would be reasonable.
Speaker 6 00:45:13 Right? Yes.
Alycia Vail 00:45:14 So that's why I tell people, make sure you know, you want to do this because it is a lot and it's a lot of growing. It's a lot of learning. It can be really great. So rewarding. However, it is difficult.
Tyson Mutrux 00:45:25 Yeah. Well it's all about time management because how do you how are you able to run the firm, run the collective managed cases. All that. How were you able to do all that?
Alycia Vail 00:45:34 Thank God I have a like a a my my a team is what I call them of course.
Alycia Vail 00:45:38 So you know like they are fantastic. So I've got my operations manager and my engagement specialist, my events and marketing coordinator, my account manager, and my senior paralegal. I call her senior paralegal because one, she was my very first ever paralegal. we will be eventually getting, you know, another paralegal. And so I wanted her to already have the senior title. and so with those, I'm able to actually, you know, stop and come and do things like this, promote the firm, and then they keep me on track, like, on top of my schedule. So fun fact, my mom is my operations manager.
Tyson Mutrux 00:46:14 Oh that's.
Speaker 6 00:46:14 Fantastic. So okay.
Alycia Vail 00:46:15 If you can imagine, like if your mom, you know, working with you or like, your wife working with you or something, where they just will make sure you're on top of things. And so it's really great to have her not only be my mom, but also kind of like my mom to my, you know, mom to my clients or even to my team members as needed.
Alycia Vail 00:46:29 And I feel like that that gives an extra special touch to the firm whenever they are communicating with team members. Because okay, if they can't get me, if the clients can't get me, they know they can reach somebody else who is going to care. And so I think it ends up working out. We'll see. I just had to like, make my team kind of small to start. We'll see if we're going to grow and how we're going to grow it. Our clientele has been growing. It's been really cool to see. I want to make sure I can serve them well and also like time blocking discipline. That's what my business coaches have told me and instilled in me. Yeah. And so I think that that has helped a lot. I'm still learning. I'm still growing. I'm certainly not perfect at it, but trying.
Tyson Mutrux 00:47:04 Time blocking is absolutely crucial. So you how old are you from August 2024. So you have, I mean, I'd say a bigger staff than most people whenever they're first starting out.
Tyson Mutrux 00:47:17 So this is sort of a combination question where I wonder, how did you know to have the staff you have? And then a lot of people are going to wonder how you're able to pay for it. So. Because it is like just starting out. So did you invest a lot into the firm at the beginning? Because that is I the reason I'm asking, because I think a lot of people are gonna have that question. So because there's a lot of people that are when they first start out, it's just them, right? Yeah. So that's why it's a two part. So how were you able to to pay for it? You answered that where you made sure you invested into the firm.
Speaker 6 00:47:50 At the beginning, I.
Alycia Vail 00:47:51 Invested everything I had to begin with. So, like me personally, was broke. But the firm was doing great to begin.
Speaker 6 00:47:56 Yeah.
Tyson Mutrux 00:47:56 Okay.
Speaker 6 00:47:56 Gotcha.
Alycia Vail 00:47:57 And then, of course, I have my lovely husband. So then that helped.
Tyson Mutrux 00:47:59 That's. That's always nice to.
Tyson Mutrux 00:48:01 Yeah, absolutely. So I guess, how did you know what butts to put on the bus?
Alycia Vail 00:48:06 I didn't, I was terrified, I thought.
Speaker 6 00:48:09 But.
Alycia Vail 00:48:09 The main thing was, is I didn't want to fail my clients. And so as I saw the money coming in, I just reached out to the people who I knew had already been there for me from for years prior to the firm ever being involved, or people who had already encouraged me to start the firm and said that they would have my back from the beginning. So to be truthful, like thankfully when I first started out and everybody kind of started with a starter salary, understand? Well, not a real salary, you know, contract work, but they all understood that this is a place that we're going to be growing. So this is not what we're just starting here, but we want to make sure that this thing gets off to a good start. And so that really helped out. Well, it's because everyone had the understanding of what we were trying to build.
Alycia Vail 00:48:48 And then from there, as the firm continued to grow, then everybody, you know, I put raises based off of the growth of the firm essentially. And so then that really helped out.
Tyson Mutrux 00:48:57 I find it so interesting how if you look at a law firm and then like, let's use, use like a restaurant or a gas station or whatever, I think it's kind of funny how lawyers, they will start with one person, maybe two, but like a restaurant, they have like 20 people like or like a gas station. There's like ten people where like, so they have to start at a certain way with a number of people. And then like the upfront costs are so so much. Whereas like a lawyer, they'll just start with one person I do. I've always found it kind of interesting how we kind of do that to ourselves. We're like, ideally it's probably best from a client standpoint and like actually handling the case from case management standpoint to actually start with the team, you know.
Speaker 6 00:49:37 What I mean?
Alycia Vail 00:49:38 Absolutely.
Alycia Vail 00:49:38 And I mean, and that was it for me. It's like I saw the clients coming in because that I wanted to wait to hire anyone until I saw that. Right. And I'm like, okay, this is happening. This is a real thing. Now let's provide a really good service for them and like, let's keep it going and let them refer people to us and let us, you know, just continuing to have clients.
Tyson Mutrux 00:49:54 So tell me about that entrepreneurial spark that that nudged you in this direction.
Speaker 6 00:50:00 I wish I really.
Alycia Vail 00:50:01 Knew, I always thought I didn't want to be a firm owner, a business owner. I know it seems weird. And now, now that I started this business, I got like five, right? Like, but, it was more so about, like, wanting. I always thought I was a busy bee or a worker bee and like, I could take instruction really well and like, let me just work hard. But then I started seeing like, all the effort I would be putting into things, and then maybe they weren't being used, or maybe they weren't really appreciated or whatever it may be.
Alycia Vail 00:50:26 And then also, I never got the final say with what it was that I was suggesting. And one of my this is going to be a little bomb drop. But my karate instructor had.
Speaker 6 00:50:34 Told me, yeah.
Tyson Mutrux 00:50:36 My wife does taekwondo. She she just got her black belt on Friday. So, Yeah.
Alycia Vail 00:50:41 but, he told me, like, I don't do well under poor leadership. And that's, I mean, years ago. And it was so true. And again, not to say that everybody who I worked for before, you know, were poor leaders or anything like that. It's just I have a structure in my mind that I wanted to create, and I had a vision that I wanted to see, and I had to do it.
Tyson Mutrux 00:50:59 So he told you you don't do. Well, I think that I don't think anybody does well under poorly.
Speaker 6 00:51:04 You know what I mean?
Alycia Vail 00:51:05 I mean.
Speaker 6 00:51:05 I would agree.
Alycia Vail 00:51:06 But at the same time it's like if I see it, I'm going to start taking action on it, whereas other people may sit and be passive about it, I don't know.
Tyson Mutrux 00:51:13 How is that influenced you whenever it comes to how you manage your people?
Alycia Vail 00:51:16 I try to be very inclusive when it but maybe like, overly inclusive. So I'm having to learn how to like.
Speaker 6 00:51:21 What do you.
Alycia Vail 00:51:21 Mean about the balance? Well, I'm trying to have the balance right of. Okay, like what it means to be the boss. Right? But at the same time. So not oversharing with certain information or oversharing when it comes to like, you know, how I would talk to my girlfriend about, oh, my gosh, can you believe this happened at work today? Like, I can't really do that in that regard. As the boss, however, I can have the inclusivity when it comes to, hey, are these systems working for you? Hey, do you like working here? Hey, when I gave you this instruction, did that work? You know, Hey, is this too much of a caseload? Dude, what do you have on your plate? So I try to be inclusive in that way, because I think it makes sense to have people who are fully working give you guidance on how it's going to, like, help your clients and help them.
Alycia Vail 00:52:00 I think a lot of times people focus on the client aspect, which is great, but I think what's forgotten are the people who work for the clients.
Tyson Mutrux 00:52:08 I do agree 100%. There is also like I'm a firm believer that you don't like you're not family, you're just not. I mean, it's.
Speaker 6 00:52:15 And that makes sense. Yeah.
Alycia Vail 00:52:17 And I and so I think that's why I always like I hesitate to use the term like family when it comes to friends or clients or whatever, because it's I want to say it's community based. and then you put whatever passion you have towards it, you know, like that person clearly needs to be in that role because of the passion, their dedication, their goals. X, Y, and Z, compared to it being like, okay, a family type driven.
Speaker 6 00:52:36 Yeah.
Tyson Mutrux 00:52:37 And it doesn't mean you can't like actually care. Like because there's a difference. Like, you know, I'm not going to go hang out and, you know, drink bourbon and whatever go.
Tyson Mutrux 00:52:47 I mean, maybe we'll go bowling or something like we're not going to go like hang out, like we're, you know, best friends, you know, but like I can still, like, show appreciation. I can still go and like ask you how your how's your daughter doing? Like, you know, like things like that, that you can still kind of show that you actually care, but without crossing the line.
Alycia Vail 00:53:05 Well, you see, I haven't gotten that opportunity yet because everybody who works with me has either worked with me in the past or has been a friend of mine, or have I used the service of theirs in the past to.
Speaker 6 00:53:15 Where.
Alycia Vail 00:53:15 It works out. So I haven't had like a perfect stranger, if you will. Right? Because I don't know, because these people are people who I kind of come up with. Right? Like my first paralegal. Like, we could go to the bar and then. You ready to go back to work? Yes, absolutely.
Speaker 6 00:53:29 Like.
Alycia Vail 00:53:29 Yeah. And and so, like, we have that good balance of we can go party on the weekend. We can come back, be serious about work like it never happened. We don't care about it. We're not talking about it. We move on. But I think there's only certain people that you can be like that with.
Tyson Mutrux 00:53:41 Yeah, I would agree with that because it as long as you can still be real with them and yes.
Speaker 6 00:53:46 And that gets.
Tyson Mutrux 00:53:47 Done and yeah. And like so it's funny. So my wife is our CFO and we employees will kind of like they'll be so surprised because I, I treat her like an actual employee right when we talk. And so we kind of we were joking not too long ago about this, she and I were. But it's like when what kind of bed heads. But like the same way I would butt heads with any other employees, like, we're like because we're very open about disagreeing about stuff like being disagreeable is important. Yes. So but like in a, in an not in a negative way.
Tyson Mutrux 00:54:15 Right. Yeah. But people are surprised when they see that I'm. I speak to her the exact same way that I would speak to anybody else in the firm. Yeah, and you bet that's that's how you have to.
Speaker 6 00:54:25 Be exactly like that.
Tyson Mutrux 00:54:27 Even the employees that you might be a friend of yours. Right? You have to be the same way. Because if you if the other employees sense that you're treating them differently, then that'll create a that's gonna create a problem.
Alycia Vail 00:54:37 Exactly. And that was the thing I never wanted. And I always heard about, you know, don't hire friends. And so I was always nervous about that. But then I'm also nervous about hiring a perfect stranger who, I don't know, their track record or their work ethic or whatever. So it's such a learning experience. It's going to be very interesting to see how it all plays out. But right now that's my A-Team and it's there.
Tyson Mutrux 00:54:54 That's awesome. And like, I like I like the excitement that you have.
Tyson Mutrux 00:54:58 I think it's you're it's such an exciting, exciting part where like you're in the for within the first year. You're the first. We're six months. Yeah.
Speaker 6 00:55:06 You're just over there.
Tyson Mutrux 00:55:07 Yeah. But, like, it's a really exciting time.
Alycia Vail 00:55:10 It's fun.
Speaker 6 00:55:10 Yeah.
Tyson Mutrux 00:55:11 That is really incredible.
Speaker 6 00:55:12 Yeah.
Tyson Mutrux 00:55:13 Is there anything that you thought? Did you have some sort of idea about how things were going to be before you started? That isn't that you realize now? It's not quite that way.
Alycia Vail 00:55:24 So in one way, I just was afraid.
Speaker 6 00:55:26 Of, like.
Alycia Vail 00:55:26 Where is the money going to come.
Speaker 6 00:55:27 From?
Alycia Vail 00:55:28 Yeah. Like that was the number one thing. I just had no idea of what to do, how to do it, whatever. And so it's just odd. As soon as you say you're open, like people know about it and it just comes. And of course you have to do the Google stuff. You have to do SEO and everything. So I think that one, it's like if fear is holding anyone back type of thing from starting it, just realizing, like once you get it started, the money will come.
Alycia Vail 00:55:48 of course you have to put the work in, you have to show up every day. But still, I mean, you have to do good work. but so I think that was the first one and then the other, like, misconception I had. Well, no, I really think that was it. Like, I was just terrified. I didn't want to start it because I was like, I don't want to be broke. I, I enjoy making money. I'm, you know, I'm like a senior attorney. There's no reason for me to.
Tyson Mutrux 00:56:09 That's where it's tough. Like. Like someone that's worked for a little bit. Yeah. And then they're making good money. And then you go and you're like, I don't know if I want to take this.
Speaker 6 00:56:15 Yeah, take this.
Alycia Vail 00:56:15 And then it is. And it's a pay cut for myself personally. However, I know what it could look like in the future. You know, in my head, this grand vision, it's important.
Alycia Vail 00:56:25 Yeah. And I think I think that was really it outside of, like, having a meeting place in person, I always knew I'm a dog mom. So if you couldn't tell as much as I'm talking about dogs these days. But. So I always wanted a place that I knew like it could be pet friendly. And then being on the Beltline in Atlanta is so huge, because that's the place that I always would go with my dogs or just walk for exercise. There's just good foot traffic, so I feel like I wasn't expecting to have that kind of space so soon. But we have had more clients want to meet in person and so it has worked out.
Tyson Mutrux 00:56:54 So you mentioned fear. do you have any fear that I might destroy the estate planning.
Speaker 6 00:56:59 Part of the firm?
Alycia Vail 00:57:00 Absolutely not. It can only enhance that I feel interesting.
Tyson Mutrux 00:57:03 Okay, I, I love this. So tell me.
Speaker 6 00:57:06 More.
Alycia Vail 00:57:07 Well because one, everybody wants what they want quickly, right? And if we can do a quick turnaround time for our clients by using utilizing AI.
Alycia Vail 00:57:15 So like we have wealth counsel and LexisNexis. And so, you know, anytime we can do anything that's going to help make it production faster and more seamless. That's something I think that that's a benefit to our clients.
Tyson Mutrux 00:57:26 So let me tell you my concern about estate planning specifically. And tell me where I'm missing. Okay. And I hope I'm wrong. I really do, because I think there are certain areas of law that are they're not going to be touched by AI. Well, they'll be touched by, but it's not going to replace it. Like AI is not going to replace a trial lawyer. They're just not like it's not gonna replace family law. It's not going to.
Speaker 6 00:57:45 No, because.
Alycia Vail 00:57:45 There's.
Speaker 6 00:57:45 Too.
Alycia Vail 00:57:45 Many nuances.
Tyson Mutrux 00:57:47 But I mean, I might create enough autonomous vehicles where you're there's no car crashes, you know, so that might happen. And I mean, in the future, it might happen.
Alycia Vail 00:57:54 It happens.
Tyson Mutrux 00:57:55 It happens.
Alycia Vail 00:57:55 But I still don't want to be in one.
Tyson Mutrux 00:57:57 With this, with estate planning. Yeah, I could totally, because we're working with AI agents now, and I could totally see building an AI agent that can communicate directly with a potential client, and then building out whatever package they need at a fraction of a cost and time and cost of a human.
Alycia Vail 00:58:17 Yeah. I mean, I mean, you know, they already got that with like, Rocket Lawyer and all these other things to a degree. And I just think no matter what, like if you're the type of person who wants to double check and make sure that it's right, unless it said it's been reviewed and approved by a lawyer, I'm not going to use that document. So I think that there are people who are, of course, there's always going to be people who want the easiest route, the cheapest route, but it's not always going to be the best.
Tyson Mutrux 00:58:39 Yeah. Do you think it's going to bring prices down?
Speaker 6 00:58:43 I don't know.
Alycia Vail 00:58:44 I've kept my prices pretty relatively like low for estate planning, because I think that it's more welcoming for people.
Alycia Vail 00:58:50 I think more people should get it anyways. And it's always, you know, you can always update it probably. I think some of the prices probably should be down.
Tyson Mutrux 00:58:57 Yeah. What I'm hoping is because, I mean, the percentage of people that actually have any sort of estate plan. Yeah, it's like it's low.
Speaker 6 00:59:05 Most people I don't know.
Alycia Vail 00:59:06 Yeah, most people I know don't have one. And I think that that's unacceptable.
Tyson Mutrux 00:59:08 Yeah. So maybe what maybe what might happen is that it gives access to to those people that wouldn't ordinarily get it where they would get it. And but I don't know, I, I hope I'm wrong. Maybe maybe it doesn't affect the estate planning industry at all, other than it makes those jobs easier. And yeah, the people that would hire an AI agent are now going to hire a lawyer anyways, and the people are going to hire a lawyer. I was going to hire a lawyer.
Speaker 6 00:59:33 Right.
Alycia Vail 00:59:33 And, you know, and like I said, people who are always just going to go grab some documents really quickly and just hope it applies to them and works out and hope that they got everything covered.
Alycia Vail 00:59:40 They'll do that. But I hope that people will still get a lawyer to at least look over it.
Tyson Mutrux 00:59:45 Yeah, I hope so too. I hope.
Speaker 6 00:59:47 So.
Tyson Mutrux 00:59:47 From lawyers in general, because it is nice having a lawyer with a brain. Yeah, actually.
Speaker 6 00:59:52 To look over.
Alycia Vail 00:59:53 Just double check. Hey, the law may have just changed or it's about to change. Like, I don't know, because, you know, sometimes I can't do the future situations like that, so who knows.
Speaker 6 01:00:00 Yeah.
Tyson Mutrux 01:00:01 So if you could sit down with your younger self before starting the firm.
Alycia Vail 01:00:07 Oh, don't make me.
Speaker 6 01:00:08 Cry.
Tyson Mutrux 01:00:08 So I won't I. Hopefully not.
Speaker 6 01:00:11 Okay.
Tyson Mutrux 01:00:11 What would you tell her about the reality of building something from the ground up?
Alycia Vail 01:00:16 Oh man, it is extremely tough. And you've got to have a really great support system around you. And you've got to have people who help keep you grounded. People who not only keep you accountable, but allow themselves to be kept accountable.
Tyson Mutrux 01:00:27 Accountability.
Tyson Mutrux 01:00:28 How is that something? How how were you able to keep yourself accountable? And how were you able to keep the team accountable?
Alycia Vail 01:00:33 So part of that is just being transparent with what my schedule looks like, with what my block schedule, you know, the what did I say, the time blocking situation. You know what I'm doing, why I'm doing it, if I'm actually taking a break. Because yes, I need to breathe, you know, or go to a Pilates class, or if I'm doing deep work where I'm doing legal research and I can't be distracted. and so that way they see every single day what I'm doing for them and for the firm. And then on the other side of it, hearing them out. My team members, if they have any questions, concerns, making sure that when they submit documents for me to review because I've tasked them with all these things to do, that I get it to them, you know, within minutes, if not at least within 24 hours.
Alycia Vail 01:01:11 So that way they see how serious I am and how much I appreciate the work that they do. And then we can all stay on top of that, to be accountable to the client, to make sure that we're ahead of deadlines and things like that.
Tyson Mutrux 01:01:21 You mentioned, deep work. Cal Newport wrote the book Deep Work. And have you read since you mentioned I've got to ask it because it's my favorite book. Have you have you read A World Without Email?
Speaker 6 01:01:32 No.
Tyson Mutrux 01:01:32 Okay. You should check it out.
Speaker 6 01:01:33 Okay.
Tyson Mutrux 01:01:34 It will. It will change the way you view work.
Speaker 6 01:01:37 Okay.
Tyson Mutrux 01:01:38 It. If it doesn't, there's. You didn't read.
Speaker 6 01:01:40 It?
Alycia Vail 01:01:41 No, I need.
Speaker 6 01:01:41 To, I need.
Tyson Mutrux 01:01:41 To. It is. It really is. Because it's by. It's by Cal Newport and Newport. And the importance of, you know, you know, ports of deep work. Deep work. But then he he then analyzes it. You know, it's called a world without email. But he then analyzes though, okay, like what work should actually look like.
Tyson Mutrux 01:01:58 And reconfiguring schedules and everything. It's. It's quite interesting. That's the main reason why we reconfigured our case management system and why we, we use now office hours instead of like, letting people communicate throughout the day. So there's all these different things that we did that have made.
Speaker 6 01:02:15 The.
Alycia Vail 01:02:15 World without.
Speaker 6 01:02:16 Email. Yeah, really.
Tyson Mutrux 01:02:17 Massive, massive efficiencies. So it's really nice.
Alycia Vail 01:02:21 Yeah. Efficiency is our word. Of course. So yeah.
Tyson Mutrux 01:02:24 Were there any before you started the firm? Were there any moments of self-doubt that you had?
Speaker 6 01:02:28 Oh, yeah.
Tyson Mutrux 01:02:29 Tell me.
Speaker 6 01:02:29 About that.
Alycia Vail 01:02:30 I only just recently I feel I got over that imposter syndrome. Yeah, right. Like one I like I said, I'd been barred five years so that already, you know, it's kind of like a mark against me, if you will, because people are just like. Oh, okay. Well, she, you know, she just hasn't been doing it for 20 plus years. However, I've been working with these 20 plus years attorneys or against them or whatnot this entire time.
Alycia Vail 01:02:49 And I also have the five years prior experience, you know, in the legal world and in the field in general. So I think feeling like I was going to need to prove myself, and then also making sure that I had enough time to continue to stay up on what the laws are doing, what's changing. You know how I can best advocate for my clients. So certainly doubt because you just see other people doing it. You know, everybody who I I've known who started a firm either they did it like right out of law school and I thought they were crazy or, you know, they've been doing it for 20.
Speaker 6 01:03:17 Years, right?
Alycia Vail 01:03:18 But, you know, everyone has to get started somewhere. And I feel like I was just a perfectionist, of course. Right. I want to get it right. I want to get it right the first time. I want to do so well, you know, and I also don't want to do any disservice to my clients.
Tyson Mutrux 01:03:31 Did anyone ever openly doubt you or tell you that you shouldn't do it?
Alycia Vail 01:03:36 I don't think so.
Alycia Vail 01:03:37 I don't think so. Which is a great, great thing, right? Yeah. I feel like I almost like, was waiting for someone to. So then I could be like, yeah, that makes sense. I shouldn't do.
Speaker 6 01:03:45 It.
Tyson Mutrux 01:03:45 Yeah. What would you say to them if they had.
Alycia Vail 01:03:49 Honestly, it's more so going to be like, okay, cool, I'm going to prove you wrong. Probably too. So it depends. It depends on who it is, right? If it was my husband, then I might be like, you know what? You're right.
Speaker 6 01:03:57 Let's not.
Alycia Vail 01:03:58 Yeah, yeah. Let's not, let's not do it. But former bosses, you know, it's like, okay, I'll see you on the other side.
Tyson Mutrux 01:04:03 I wish you would say it. That's right. That's,
Alycia Vail 01:04:05 Yeah. Thankfully, I have great relationships with all of them. You know, after leaving, in my mind.
Tyson Mutrux 01:04:10 I once had a boss. it was the the first firm I worked for at a law school.
Tyson Mutrux 01:04:16 He told me, because I didn't come in on the day after Thanksgiving and on the Saturday after Thanksgiving. But he didn't think I had what it would take to be a lawyer. And I was like, I've revisited. I do it less often because I don't think it's it's I don't think it's it's it's not wise or good to hold on to that poison.
Speaker 6 01:04:33 But.
Tyson Mutrux 01:04:34 I will sometimes revisit that and.
Speaker 6 01:04:36 Get that fire going.
Tyson Mutrux 01:04:37 A little bit. Right. Because it's like. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Sometimes I don't know sometimes that fire is a little good.
Speaker 6 01:04:43 No for sure.
Alycia Vail 01:04:44 And I also think it was just kind of like thinking back to why I wanted it to be virtual and why I wanted to start my own thing because people are working 9 to 5. I actually before Covid, I don't remember like how everyone did it.
Speaker 6 01:04:55 Yeah, it.
Tyson Mutrux 01:04:56 Was like a weird reset that like the old, old world and the new world are different.
Speaker 6 01:05:00 You can't remember. Then you go to work every day.
Alycia Vail 01:05:02 So you tell me, you go to work every day, then you come home and then you're like feeding the dogs, feeding the kids, whatever. Getting the kids off the school bus, doing homework, God, you know, and then bedtime. That sounds insane and and tough and and then so for me, I wanted my team to be able to actually have, like we do half day Fridays. And I mean that like we only work half day. You all need to get your doctor's appointment scheduled or do whatever. And if you need to actually switch it, because some doctors are not even open on Fridays, which is good for them, but like, you know, bad for other people, it's like, cool. Then you can switch your schedule around if you need to go on Monday or whatever, because we have a flexible schedule because we're virtual. So I expect that you're going to get your work done daily within the hours that you need to get them done. So if that means you're working 3 a.m. to, you know, 6 a.m., that's fine by me.
Alycia Vail 01:05:42 I don't care as long as the tasks are completed. And I think that giving people like being able to give people that type of work environment is really important to me because I felt like that's how I thrive. And I think that that's how the firm can thrive, because the people who are working there are taken care of, like head to toe. You know what I mean? Like all.
Speaker 6 01:05:59 Over.
Tyson Mutrux 01:05:59 Yeah. So that's why we went to a four day workweek. And it was. Yeah, it's really nice.
Alycia Vail 01:06:04 Monday through Thursday, I'm assuming.
Tyson Mutrux 01:06:05 Or. Well, we it's they're rotating on teams. So it depends on what team you're on okay. And they flip. So like every time it flips the it's funny because one of the teams will get a four day workweek and they love it. So they so they everyone the every team ends up getting like a couple four day workweeks at least I think it's like three a year. So, so every month it flips. And so it's either Monday or Friday.
Tyson Mutrux 01:06:28 And so we want, we want to make sure that we have full coverage from Tuesday to Thursday. So and then Monday, Friday we, we we have a smaller crew. Yeah. And people love it. They would I think if I said we're going back to five days they would quit. I think people would absolutely quit.
Alycia Vail 01:06:45 I don't know how people live.
Speaker 6 01:06:46 Yeah.
Tyson Mutrux 01:06:47 So how do you balance creating like a good work culture and then also but making sure that people are getting their jobs done?
Alycia Vail 01:06:55 I think it just comes back to when I was saying how being the worker bee, and then also how I came up in the legal field from being a legal intern, legal assistant, and then the attorney. Yeah, I've got to see every aspect of what it means to work in a law firm. And then I know how I pushed myself in those roles. And so I just do my best to try to provide my team members everything they need to succeed in their roles. And if they suggest something else we want, we want to incorporate that.
Alycia Vail 01:07:20 Let them know that I actually hear them. And if we can do it, great. If we can't do it, explain why I think that that sometimes where people fail, where they just like hear it, they're like, I'm busy, you know, and then moving on and then it's never acknowledged. People don't understand, you know, there may be some resentment building up. so I've always seen the entrepreneur side of it or the boss side of it from the workers perspective. I've never run a firm before. I've never run a business before. So this is where I'm saying, like, I'm having to get better at delegating. I'm having to get better at certain boundaries that I know that I'm going to have to have or have set. But it's fun learning. And thankfully, most people, if you will like, stay in their lane. Like most people aren't trying to do anything extra. They're just happy to do the work they're doing. If I ask them to do anything more, they will.
Alycia Vail 01:08:01 They show up. And if they don't show up, we have a talk about that. Sure. Hi. What's happening?
Tyson Mutrux 01:08:05 Because so do you have. Because I'm sure that people are listening to this. And we've we've had several remote firms on, you know, and you may be you may have the most energy out of all of them, I'll tell you that it's it's great the but I know a big question we get from a lot of people and the I'm sure the people are listening right now wondering the same thing is like, how do you know like that? Sally Jo is not, you know, shopping all day. How do you know that she's, you know, not hopefully you don't have a Sally Jo at your firm, but, you know, it would be really funny if you did.
Speaker 6 01:08:36 Yeah. No. Sally.
Tyson Mutrux 01:08:36 Yes. Yeah. But, like, how do you how do you make sure that they're, they're doing the things that you expected.
Alycia Vail 01:08:44 Yeah. And I think that that's where task lists come into play.
Alycia Vail 01:08:47 Having some sort of case management system or tracking situation, even if you don't have a case management system like Asana or Trello or Monday or whatever, just anything that you can keep track of tasks with. Because for me, it's always about showing your work. And so I'm not going to run you down, but I would like for you to not only check off completion whenever you've completed a task or put notes in, put the time entry in. We are a flat fee firm so we don't build our clients, but I still want to see the work being done. Sure, so that helps them a lot. It helps both of us keep stay accountable on all sides.
Tyson Mutrux 01:09:17 Yeah, I frankly don't care as long as they're hitting their targets I don't care. I if if they I mean they're they're adults, right. And if they're hitting their targets that we've set for them and if they need to take 15 minutes to go shop on Amazon.
Speaker 6 01:09:31 I'm like, absolutely.
Alycia Vail 01:09:31 Go, yeah, I hope you got something good.
Alycia Vail 01:09:33 And was there a good deal? Like let me know.
Tyson Mutrux 01:09:35 Because I it's just interesting to me there will be attorneys that are listening to this and those like you know, they get on Amazon themselves right and well and they'll say, well, I'm paying the bills. Well, I mean, let's be reasonable here. You know what I mean?
Alycia Vail 01:09:48 Like everybody's.
Speaker 6 01:09:49 Working.
Tyson Mutrux 01:09:50 Exactly. If they're if they're working and they're hitting the targets, it doesn't matter. You shouldn't.
Speaker 6 01:09:53 Care. Absolutely. They shouldn't.
Alycia Vail 01:09:55 I mean that that's exactly how I feel about it. And I don't want to give them extra pressure. So we actually don't have, like, target goals, if you will. Our stuff is task based because we're not unbelievable. But even still, like, I've been able to see the work being done. And if I have seen that someone's been ghost for a minute, you know, or if I do periodically check because of course I got to check the time injuries. I've got to see what people are doing and if or the completion of tasks.
Alycia Vail 01:10:14 And if I see that there's something lacking, then I'll talk to the person about it.
Tyson Mutrux 01:10:17 But yeah, I think I think that I think that's definitely the right approach. Like talk to the person. Like actually talk to the person. Don't send them a message. Actually call them. You know you can actually speak to them. So a few a few more questions and then I'll have you out of here.
Alycia Vail 01:10:32 But hold.
Speaker 6 01:10:33 Me hostage.
Tyson Mutrux 01:10:35 You're doing great, I love it. So people seem to buy into the person before they're actually going to buy into the product or the service, right? And I wonder, I guess, what is it about you that you want clients to buy into?
Alycia Vail 01:10:51 Oh, I guess kind of that. Like, I actually do really care. I think when people understand that the person who is serving them, whether or not, you know, like depending on the the field they're in, that they actually care not only about the quality of work that they do and provide, but in the quality of service.
Alycia Vail 01:11:06 But as about the person in general, because, you know, again, it's so easy to think, okay, they're just in it for the money or okay, this is just another case to them, you know, another number. And for me in my team especially, like we do really take the time to get to know our people, to engage with them, to, you know, send them a gift or send them, you know, get well or whatever it may be, because we want to make sure that the person who had to come to us and who had to, like, break down and, you know, if they're getting to the point of having to contact us, you know, something most likely went wrong.
Speaker 6 01:11:34 Sure.
Alycia Vail 01:11:35 Or they're in preparation for something, which is fine, But I think that it's important, especially in this field, to actually genuinely, personally care.
Tyson Mutrux 01:11:43 Last question. Okay. So it is January 1st of 2027. Ooh. Okay.
Speaker 6 01:11:51 Okay.
Tyson Mutrux 01:11:52 What is the firm look like at that time.
Alycia Vail 01:11:54 So. Well, our multimillion dollar firm for one. And I think we're still going to definitely be virtual. I still want to hone into that now, whether or not we get other satellite kind of bases for in-person client meetings, that might be something that comes might be something that comes with different team members in those positions. You know, throughout the state. So we'll see. We've been getting a lot of people from Savannah, Georgia and Macon and further south where I'm from. So that's been pretty cool to see. And that's where I put my first billboard, right across the street from Waycross College, where I went, you know. So I just feel like I think the firm definitely is going to grow, and people are really going to see the Georgia Peach attorney like throughout Georgia. I hope that we can have more community events not only in the metro Atlanta area, but in those same places, that I named Dalton also being one of the places. So not only can I engage with my initial community who helped give me the courage to even start my own firm, or who's sending, you know, clients to me, but also for us to just give back to those communities and make sure that they have resources that they need.
Tyson Mutrux 01:12:52 So what's the number one thing you need to focus on between now and then to make sure that you hit that target?
Alycia Vail 01:12:57 Well, certainly still on the marketing side of things. And then also like when it comes to our clients, like providing great service for them and then kind of closing their cases out quickly, I think, or quicker, as quickly as we can. You know, I think that that definitely helps because it gives an overall good client experience and then they're more likely to recommend people.
Tyson Mutrux 01:13:16 Lisa, thanks for taking the time to do this. Really appreciate it. And thanks for bringing the energy I needed it.
Alycia Vail 01:13:20 Yes of course.
Speaker 6 01:13:21 Happy to be here. Have a good one.
Speaker 7 01:13:22 You too.
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