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Tiger Tactics Secrets to Success w/Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
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LET'S PARTNER UP AND MAXIMIZE YOUR FIRM

Today on the show we have Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky, co-authors of Tiger Tactics: Powerful Strategies for Winning Law Firms.

They’ll discuss staying energized, their favorite chapters of Tiger Tactics, writing a book with multiple authors, and things they wish they could tell their younger selves. If you listen closely you’ll even get to hear the story of Bill’s enlightening California bender, how to create a vision, and how to maintain balance in your lives and practices.

Hacking’s Hack: Tiger Tactics and Dare to Lead Renee Brown

Business owners need to build an environment for connection

Tyson’s Tip: My advice is to read one chapter and think about it for a few days. Take your time with Tiger Tactics, don’t rush though it. Live the principles.

Jay’s Tip: We’re in a people business. We just finished Q1. You should be 25% of the way towards your goals. Reach out to past connections you have fallen out of touch with. Send out personalized note cards.

Ryan’s Tip: If you can at all buy noise canceling headphones, they will help you be way more productive. We like Bose noise-canceling headphones.

Reach out if you need help. Many lawyers are afraid to get help when they are suffering. You are not alone.

Bill’s Tip: In this age of personal connection, it is important to do a lot of videos. Toss out your old videos that aren’t good anymore.

Get a video coach to shoot better videos.

Tiger Tactics:

Make sure to register for MaxLawCon19, June 6 and 7 in St.Louis.

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You can also go to MaximumLawyer.com or, if you’d prefer, email us at: info@maximumlawyer.com

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Welcome to the Maximum Lawyer Podcast. Partner up, and maximize your firm.

 

 

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Transcript: Tiger Tactics Secrets to Success w/Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky

Ryan
One of the great, like richness in my life is the people I’ve met the contacts the community that I have and getting to know people, their families, their kids, their struggles, helping them. You know that that is something that when it’s all said and done, it’s like I will look back on and just be like that is one of the greatest accumulations of wealth in my entire life. And I encourage anybody out there to go out there and build it. Run your law firm the right way.

Unknown Speaker
This is the maximum lawyer podcast, podcast, your hosts, Jim hacking, and Tyson Meatrix. Let’s partner up and maximize your firm. Welcome to the show.

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
Your backup podcast I’m Jim hacking.

Tyson Mutrux
And I’m Jason matrix. What’s up Jimmy? Oh, Tyson.

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
We got a crazy show today.

Tyson Mutrux
We i This is the first episode we’ve had with a shirtless person. So this this we know maximum lawyer first. Why don’t you introduce our guests Mr. Tyson? No, I’m not doing full bios. Okay, so but we do have I’m gonna go from left to right on my screen, even though he’s the last one to join us. Wild Bill you Mansky dollar bill. He’s on here. We got Ryan McKean. And J. Ruane three of the authors of Tiger tactics. This is pretty excited is exciting for me. I’m friends with all three of them. And so for example, I don’t know if you’ve noticed in the background, Ryan McKean has, like 20 books positioned strategically. So you can see.

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
It’s pretty exciting. So, you know,

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
how did the idea of Tiger tactics even come about? And how did you get involved in?

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
You know, that’s a great question to ask. Jay. And Ryan, those guys are the guys that created it. Along with Billy. And I think I was a, an add along for them. Kind of like a last minute, Bill.

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
All right. Well, then let’s hear from Ryan Ryan, give us the lowdown on how this all got started.

Ryan
It started really add on J. Billy and I were members at the Rosen sky heroes. And, and because we were frequent posters, Lee kind of corralled us, and put us in our own little mini mastermind, because we go non stop talking about law practice. And so literally one Saturday morning, in July 2017, you know, we started talking, we were like, you know, what we should we were all talking about these things, we should turn it into a book. And from there, Jay, and Billy and I kind of kind of ran with it. Literally, I think that morning, Jay had rolled out a marketing campaign. Before it before we had the book, be addicted name, Tiger tactics that morning, you know, our vision for it was that we would have stories from different authors from around the country, about about their practice and about law practice and talk in a way that was honest and authentic. We added Bill Uman ski and Teresa Degray, to the project, and we worked on it for probably about almost 20 months.

Tyson Mutrux
So let me let me start with saying thanks for the invite, really appreciate you. You invited me to author the book. Appreciate it. Jay s. J, what is your favorite chapter and why

Unknown Speaker
I’ve lived with this book now for two years. And it’s to me, it’s sort of like a CD that you get from like one of your favorite artists, right? You the new CD comes out, the new album comes out, you put it on, you listen to straight through and you love a song. And then you play that song to death usually. And then a couple of months in, you’re listening to the whole CD and another song sort of takes over and becomes your new favorite song. At least that’s how it is for me. And I can listen to the same album for a year and wind up with 567 different favorite songs. So for me, working through these, these chapters, each one of them has sort of been my favorite at one point or another. I’ve gotten each one of them through the editing process and through the development process. That’s a focus on each one individually. I really do like the idea that the chapter are balanced, because it’s something that I struggle with. And I know a lot of other lawyers struggle with balance as well. And so I have read that one multiple times in balance in vision really, I would say are my two favorite chapters because in the last sort of four years, I’ve been struggling myself with developing my practice deciding where to go. And I’ll be the first to admit I sort of had like a mid career crisis in the last three years. And I’ve worked through that and I’ve sort of really come back to my love criminal defense work and and organizing my practice around that and Not taking on all these divergent areas, and partnerships with guys like Ryan finding some other local lawyers. That’s really been the stuff that that has brought me back to the book multiple times so that I can get the most out of it. So I’d say, balance and vision has really helped me personally, as I develop those chapters over the last two years, so those would be my, my favorites.

Tyson Mutrux
So Jimmy, before you jump in, I just want anyone who has the book, if anyone wants to see what Jay thought his perfect day look like, go to 289. It cracks me up. So, Jimmy,

Unknown Speaker
oh, isn’t it Oh, so if you would write out your perfect day, I mean, ice cream, ice cream, and second, my wife is embarrassed that I would put that in print. I actually gave a presentation on that to the National College for DUI defense a number of years ago down at Walt Disney World. And I got great reviews and a couple people lasted me for talking about my sex life in a presentation. But

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
I loved how in chapter one, everybody talks about how they came up with their vision for their firms. And some people were very methodical, some people were relying on logbooks. And Bill, Bill went out on a all night Bender, it’ll tell us a little bit that story about how you came up with your vision for where you wanted to be with your

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
vision. To me, that is my favorite thing in the book. Because without vision, you know, I don’t think any of us, you know, wants to wake up in the morning and do this shit, right? Running a firm, it’s kind of difficult. So, you know, mine was was based on a book, I went to an E Myth seminar out in California. And I didn’t do the homework. I wasn’t I didn’t pay attention. I spent a lot of money, I think I was just looking for a free trip out to California. And I was paying for basically some time away. And I didn’t do any of the shit that was there. And the guy that was running the guru that was running it was you know, he just he called me out in front of all these business people. And base was like, Look, you Mansky, you’re here, you paid to be here, you’re not gonna get anything out of this unless you do the homework. So, you know, instead of networking with a group that night, I told me just, you know, think about your vision for your business. You know, you read the book about E Myth, you want to be an entrepreneur, you know, live large, go out and do something that’s going to energize you have some fun, and make you actually think about the business. And that’s what happened that night. I mean, as in the book, I got a limo and I don’t want to go into the whole story. It’s in the book. But I went out, I dance, I had steak, I had wine. I started writing my vision on cocktail napkins. And I mean, it was a beautiful ending to a perfect night overlooking San Francisco and Sausalito Bay. And I finished what was still very much part of the plan. Now, that’s called my strategic objective. It’s my vision and my objective. And it really all started because I was a failure at a mastermind group and hadn’t done my homework. Without vision. You know, there is nothing without vision.

Tyson Mutrux
So I’m kind of curious, just logistically getting, I mean, you will learn some pretty high level attorneys, right? I mean, you all aren’t some schmucks that Ryan found off the street. I mean, you all are all legit lawyers. So how were you able to logistically organize this and get everyone together on the same page and writing this thing? And whoever wants

Ryan
to answer that? Can? I mean, it was the answer. It was it was hard. But what we did is, once we had the offers in place, once we went through several bids, and honestly, this was before we even knew of maximum lawyers, it feels like an eternity ago for me, and I’m sure for my co authors. But what we did is it once we had Billy J, and I, you know, it was just once we build it was when we added Theresa, I think the hardest thing was finding the author, and then we just all committed to trying to do 1500 words a week on a specific topic. And we wrote out the 10 topics that we we wanted to write about. And so that part of it probably came together pretty quick. That part probably came together in about February of 2018. And then my wife, Allison, you know, wrote some of the intros to the chapters trying to make it flow a little bit as opposed to try and just be five different essays. We got it out the various editors rewrote it. So I think that the biggest challenge was actually finding lawyers who would follow through with the content.

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
Jay, were there issues that you guys disagreed on? Were there any kind of heavy discussions about, you know, wrong approaches or differences of opinion? No, you know, that’s

Unknown Speaker
actually one of the interesting thing is that I think, because we all come from different practice areas. He says and recognize that what works for me may not work for Bill or Billy or Ryan or Teresa, everybody sort of share their own story in their own way. But if something works for you, great, if it doesn’t work for me, okay, so we learn and we adapted, we move on, you know, there, as I learned a lot about everyone I wrote with, as I was reading their stories, because that was wonderful thing, we were delivering the topics on a weekly basis. And so I had become friendly with with with Bill down in Florida, you know, and, and developed a great relationship with them and actually sets right, just wait to meet Bill, you’re gonna love them type of thing. But when when we did this, I got to know more about Bill through reading what he wrote, I got to know more about Ryan, reading, when Ryan and I have developed a great friendship. I think writing this book together helped us get even further along in their friendship. As a result, what works for him in his practice hasn’t necessarily worked for me. But we take the great things that we find tweak it, and basically use each other as a springboard to success. And I think that’s been a wonderful byproduct of working on this book together.

Ryan
Yeah, and I think jays, right, the goal, the goal was never to establish consensus. The goal was not to establish a how to manual, the goal was to really, you know, turn the mirror in ourselves. And we tried to write very hard about things that hurt, and the lessons that we learned from those things. So hopefully, you know, readers started, you know, reading and identifying maybe with parts of our story and parts and parts of my story or parts of the story. And maybe that connects with them. And so that was sort of the market need that we that we tried to fill, there’s a lot of sort of, you know, step by step, you know, here’s how you open a law firm. And here’s how you, you know, here’s what you do, the sort of Jay Freudenberg model, but we, we decided strongly to go with a story model. And I think difference was was was part of the goal, we never debated or talked amongst ourselves really, about what we wanted any specific chapter to be we just did it independently, and then tried to, you know, create some sort of fluid overlay with some, some editing.

Tyson Mutrux
I’m curious, though, now that you’ve looked back, you’ve got the hard copy of it in your hands. Is there anything you you wish you would have put in there that you didn’t put in there? And this is for both of you. So is there anything that you feel like you left out that maybe you should

Ryan
have added? Yeah, I mean, I think for me what happened in this book, there’s, there’s a lot in what happens in this book is, my life really changes almost like the minute I stopped writing this book, we I literally, when I’m writing this book, go from me and a part time employee at nine hours a week, to now in a growing firm of eat people. And, you know, there’s, there’s a lot of development that sort of happens in my life. But what I decided to do was, was, you know, resist the impulse to go back and write, because I hope that, you know, maybe that part of my life or those chapters in my life and connect with people. So I think that there’s there’s a lot of things that I you know, that I wish that there’s a lot of things, if I wrote it now would be very different. I hope that sort of my story at that phase, you know, may be relatable to a lot of people out there who were, you know, wondering doesn’t stop I listen to when the maximum lawyer podcast work, you know, does the does all the different things that we all talk about work? And, you know, it’s sort of right before, I think I hit my stride,

Unknown Speaker
I can answer that, you know, I think writing this book for me was was a bit of a cathartic moment. And it’s really only after it’s been published, and people have given me some feedback and speaking with other people, my co authors and like, it really was a cathartic experience for me, and that I was able to sort of get out a lot of things that had been deep inside me over the first 20 years of my practice. And I think it really set me up to sort of go into the second half of my career with a renewed focus, sort of give me some vim and vigor as a young lawyer, because I’ve been able to say, I definitely don’t want to do these things. And I want to laser like focus onto onto what I love and what I like to do, and the things that matter to me. And by writing each chapter and sort of working through it, I’ve been able to say, Okay, where are the things in each chapter, what has been successful for me, and it’s already always been the stuff that I find passionate, and it’s not stuff that I was doing, necessarily for money. I was looking to capitalize on something just for money. It kind of never went anywhere, and being able We’ll take a step back and see that it’s not that I was never necessarily in a in a different place than where I was. But it’s been able to give me some perspective on my practice as a whole. Ah, I don’t think it’s necessarily missing, I think it’s going to be tied to tactics book to where we can talk about how our lives have changed, and what really writing this book has given us as a as a perspective on our careers, because you don’t when you’re in it, you don’t get to see it. But when we were writing this book, we had to look at it and see where we were going. So I think that’s a wonderful thing that this book did for me,

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
I had suffered a loss of my sister in law. And then a couple of lawyers in town recently died. And basically, I didn’t really write it for me, I kind of wrote it, just saying, Look, if I’m a mess, and I’m somehow able to get it all together, have fun, and make some money and enjoy my life and practice. There’s other people out there doing that same struggle, and maybe they’ll identify through some of the silly stories, what they can do, you know, Jay, all the other guys in this book and girls, women, they’re more accomplished in many ways. I think they’re more focused, they have more structure. They’re really zeroed in on their business. I’m definitely zeroed in my business. But I have a number one thing, which is I want to have fun. And so I wrote, like, I feel I’m a sloppy guy, I’m a good lawyer. But I’m kind of sloppy, you know, I, you know, I just am all over the place. And I know I need people to structure me and stuff. So I kind of wrote these stories so that maybe people would read them and go, Wow, that guy kind of gets it, he kind of goes through stuff, he’s able to still be successful, regardless of his message. I mean, there’s some, that’s what I wrote it for is really not for me, it was really just another reader is other people have the struggle, even if they’re a first year lawyer, or 20 year lawyer. And what Jay said is really true. Like you start realizing, you know what the book means to you, when people who read it, start talking to you honestly about it. And they’ll tell you stuff. And some of it’s about what my other co authors wrote, or maybe sometimes it’s about what I wrote. But it really does strike you when people tell you, you know, that struck a chord with me, I can see why I’m doing what I’m doing now, because it’s all worth it in the end. That’s why I think it’s a cool book, actually.

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
It is definitely a cool book. And you guys talked about how it was sort of a long process, and that you’ve been working on for a long time. I’m wondering, were there things that surprised you, when it came back? From your own words, when you saw it in black and white on the print about your practice? Or about your mindset?

Ryan
It is a great question. And I think for me, it gets to the balance chapter, I think that that’s, that’s probably the most that was probably, you know, to the degree we decided, you know, write about things that hurt was sort of our, our limited directive in in taking on this project. I think the balance chapter for me is the absolute hardest I, I struggle with it, it’s an ongoing struggle. And, you know, it takes through some of the, like, really painful moments in my life. And I, I, I It’s, it’s, you know, it’s some of these things where it’s like, it was hard to write about, and it’s hard to reflect upon, like, there are things in life, I think you want to you want to forget and I think, you know, that’s, that’s some of it as at least I know, we all tried to really write honestly, and hold mirrors up to ourselves and strip away the pretense it’s not about, you know, look house, look how we became successful. Like, that’s not the book, it’s like, you know, we can almost call the book like, you know, where it’s like, we have nothing to I had this REM concert, my first concert, I saw them with Hartford in 1997 with Radiohead, and it says, you know, it’s a picture of a bear with Jack Kerouac. And it says I have nothing to offer anyone except for my own confusion. And I think we injected the book with our own confusion, and hopefully gave you know get help people along the way with with that.

Unknown Speaker
That was a great show. Was it right? I was at that show too. I don’t know if the Towson

Ryan
was as well was fantastic. That was a great show.

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
The one thing I thought about which really when I saw my own words, or Brent was the last you know, where we had to thank someone and I you know, I’m very close to my mother. And not as I am close to my dad but not as close to my father but when I read my words in print about what my dad told me, I realized that was a foundation for almost everything that I want to do in life and what I want to share with other people which is you know, don’t do stuff for money, you know, do stuff for passion, and the money will follow. And, you know, my dad is been a A good father, but not the best dad in the world. You know, it was a very difficult time growing up with him. But he gave me the greatest lesson, which is he said, you know, Bill, if you just do something for fun, you have passion following through with that stuff, you know, the money’s gonna follow if you and when I read it in print I was I really was very emotional about it because I actually felt very grateful. And it’s actually a bigger lesson. You know, sometimes we have negative perceptions, or we have negative experiences with people. And there’s always one thing that you can learn from everyone. That’s a positive. And that’s my father’s greatest lesson to me. And I hope that I pass it along to my own two boys, actually. So I know that doesn’t have much to do with the practice writing of the book. But that was really reading that in print, I got upset reading it, actually. And very thankful that my dad taught me that.

Tyson Mutrux
So this question is for each of you, and I, J, I know asked you what your favorite chapter of the book was. But this is for each of you know, I want to know what you think the most important chapter is for, for new lawyers. So if you’re a new lawyer picking this up today, let’s see graduated law school yesterday, what to each of you is the most important chapter of the book.

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
I can speak on that for me. I really

Unknown Speaker
think you got to focus on financials, my story’s in there. In fact, that was one of the things that when I showed my wife, the first draft of my chapter, she said to me, do you really want to tell people this story, because it kind of goes against the image that you have, in our community, people are going to think that you always have your stuff together, because you seem poised and polished, and, and you have these systems in your office. And I said, if I develop them, because I fail, I develop those things, because I wasn’t able to accomplish what I should have, I should have had a system for that. And all too often, I see young lawyers who get involved in cases that they shouldn’t take, because they’re taking less money than they should they’re undercutting, because they think they need to undercut to get the client, they they take in less money, they don’t protect themselves and plan for their tax needs and their living expenses. So I think if you know, if you’re only going to read one chapter, read mine about financials, and know that you got to have your house in order. Otherwise, if you don’t have that strong financial financial foundation, you’re gonna be building our house on a foundation of sand.

Ryan
For me, the chapter is, is fishing. I often think like that has been aside from balance, like, my greatest struggles, where where, you know, it’s like you do a bunch of work. And I think I talked about it in my, in my chapter, part of it’s like, we wrote this so long ago, it’s like, well, yeah, what did I have to reread the book, because people are talking to me about what I wrote. But it seems like it where it’s like, it’s one of these things where, you know, not having a vision probably cost me more than anything. And if, you know, when I sort of started to get ahead, where things sort of started to turn around with me, was when I sat down with my partner, Andrew, and we went through the traction book, and we did the worksheet, and we’re like, where do we want to go? How are we going to get there? What are we in? So often, sometimes, even internally, where we’re having a debate about what we’re going to do or whatever, you know, you know, it’s, I always raise it, like, you know, are we having a vision issue. And I think that that sort of 30,000 level foot thinking is really scary to do. Because you’re, you know, if you’re like me, you’re foregoing things. I don’t come from my choice. Like if I’m turning down a, you know, a $750, you know, real estate closing or something like that’s that that was like a big, big deal to me. But I was in a place where it was like the only way in my life was going to change, aside from just rambling constantly struggling with money was to say no, was to go in a direction that was authentically me. So I hope that all of our struggles with vision connect. And I think that that’s the single most important work for anybody starting out to do, or anybody struggling with their practice, because it’s not like you, in my opinion, it’s not like you have a vision and it’s cast in stone. It is a fluid thing. And it is it is something that will change over time. And something that just needs to be thoughtful, but you always need to have one. So as to where it is that you want to go.

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
So vision is also my most important thing. And I was until I developed a vision of who I wanted to work with me means which attorneys I wanted to hire, the type of employee I wanted how much money I actually wanted to make, the type of reputation I wanted, the type of client representation, what it would look like, all those things are very important. And so I agree with Brian. And once, if you’re a new lawyer, if you take the time, you know, you have your financials in order, and you’re going to launch a firm, but you don’t have a vision, you’re right, you will make a lot of mistakes. And Ryan is exactly right about that. I would add that it’s not what’s most important, I think those three areas, financials vision, and there’s the chapter basically on launch. If you’re a new lawyer, what I would just tell your listeners is, guys, when you’re out there, and you’re thinking about leaving your firm, or you’re making a plan of action, it’s not like you were fired like I was, and you’re put in a bad position, right off the bat, do something. If you have the time, not only should you be creating a vision, but you should really, really focus on a launch. Because synergistically if you get a great launch, if you get a great, great, great, great push forward. That is like an avalanche. I mean, it moves forward, you know? So I do think you know, Jay is absolutely right, you got to have good financials. And Ryan’s right about vision. Brand new lawyer, though, you have to have those two things and vision as part of your preparation, as well as getting your house in order financially. But having the vision, I mean, having the ability to have a launch plan, you got to get every single person in your network ready to go when you’re ready to launch that firm, so that there’s a good chance that your phone is gonna ring or you’re gonna get hit online digitally or on social media, with cases as soon as you open that door. I think that’s what’s really important to a new lawyer.

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
All right, well, this is this book is called Tiger tactics. So I want to go a little bit tactical since I have three great law firm entrepreneurs with us. And I want to read a paragraph that Jay wrote in the chapter about in person marketing. If you think you can build your entire practice off the back of online advertising, you are wrong, in the end are businesses of people business. And even though people spend hundreds of hours weekly, online, we live in an offline world and people want to connect with people. Jay, talk to us about that. And then the other guys riff off it, if you don’t mind, I think it’s a great point that we’re always trying to do everything digitally, trying to automate everything, but I think we’re seeing a swing back to more of the human to human connection.

Unknown Speaker
Well, I think, you know, one of the great things about digital marketing is that it allows you to get, right, so the type of person that needs your services. But in the end, you still need to make that personal connection, it’s actually gonna be a talk a little bit about that in my tip of the week, coming up. But I think, you know,

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
we all,

Unknown Speaker
at least I can, I know I can speak for Ryan and for Bill, and I’m not going to speak for all lawyers out there. But when you get into the practice of law, you get in because you want to help people. Money is a byproduct of, of, you know, putting in the effort going through a long lead time to go through law school. It’s a it’s a byproduct of having artificially reduced competition in the terms of a bar exam, and a high value placed on legal services in our society. But in reality, you have to have that empathy, you have to be an empathic person, and be able to connect with people. I connect with people who’ve been accused, Ryan connects with people who have been injured because he’s suffered through that Bill connects with both, and has a successful criminal practice and a successful injury practice. And I really think that if you spend your time connecting with people, that’s going to serve your practice well, for a long, long time. Don’t think that everybody is just going to hire you because you’re a commodity online, connect with people and let them embrace you, and your flaws and your humanity and embrace that in them. And they will then go out and go further and they’ll sell to people and they’ll sell 10 people and they’ll sell 100 people and next thing you know, you’ll have clients coming in in droves.

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
Jay is absolutely right. There’s just there’s also a real issue here with in person marketing. That’s really important. I believe I’m an optimist, but I was a pessimist at one point. And I will tell you that. The one reason why you should be really keen on in person marketing is if you run your firm, and you’re making a lot of money and you’re actually supporting a lot of attorneys and everything and you’re bringing in a lot of business, both through your personal networks and your digital networks. You imagine one day of Google as it does every October or or July or August, they changed their algorithm, and you just can’t get back on top. And things start slowing down. And you have still have former client referrals coming in, but you got to kind of slow down your practice, and maybe you’ve made some good financial choices. But let’s say you’re back to square one again, if you give up the in person marketing, whether you do it through someone else, if you’re running a firm, or if you’re still practicing you, your own self book yourself, your own way of generating cases, that’s your survival mode. That’s your mechanism. And for all of us who tend to be successful, you know, Jim Tyson role, there’s a lot of guys a maximum or and girls, women out there, they’re killing it. But think back like, business can turn. And if you disregard what got you there within person marketing, the relationships that you build, that is your way of if you have to downsize, you still can survive, you still can make money. I mean, my wife and I have such good relationships with people in our community, that God forbid, we had to shut our doors and 20 to 24 employees had to go away. We don’t want that to ever happen. We want to grow. And we want to sustain our employment, we love our attorneys, we love our staff. But if we ever had to downsize, I could always fall back. Even if 52 years old. I’ve got good relationships with people, deep relationships with people, people that might even hire me, people that would rent me an office, if it all went bad. People don’t give me an office, people that would still refer me cases, if I just put my pride down and go, I’m going through a tough time. So I use that as a daily reminder, every day, I want to grow, I’m not looking back, I’m not looking to fail. But I’m damn sure gonna be hungry to have that in personal relationships with people. Because if it all goes down, I’ll still be good, my wife will still be good, we’ll still be able to survive. It is so important. And I will tell you Millennials crave that connection even more. And that’s the market that we’re gearing towards, with criminal and injured clients now. So, you know, you’ve got to get out there. And you’ve got to make sure that you’ve never forget that, in my opinion,

Ryan
you start a personal injury practice, that’s really hard, in the sense that, you know, there’s so many people spending so many millions of dollars per year in every single market in this country. And so to sort of break that, it’s very hard to I agree with Jay, we are in the relationships business. And I always looked at the online content as sort of the affirmation. So if a doctor says, you know, Paul Ryan McCain, or another lawyer says, Call Ryan McCain, what are they going to do? They’re going to Google me, and at least there’s something there, there’s some, there’s some positive thing there, there’s some credible website, because you’re right, this algorithm can change tomorrow, it can all it can all go away. You know, Google is a landlord, and Google wants to raise the rent. And it’s going to be who in any market can pay the most rent is going to get the real estate that matters the most. So when I you know it, there’s a secondary component to that, and everything that Bill said everything that Jay said, but also, I think one of the great, like, richness in my life is the people I’ve met the contacts the community that I have, and getting to know people, their families, their kids, their struggles, helping them, you know that, that is something that when it’s all said and done, it’s like, I will look back on and just be like, that is one of the greatest accumulations of wealth in my entire life. And I encourage anybody out there to go out there and build it.

Tyson Mutrux
Let me just say this, uh, you will have done an incredible job on this book. So anyone that’s listening, or everyone that’s listening, get a copy of it. It’s really great. Um, what am I doing? For my last question, I’m just gonna give you one last word on whatever you want to talk about the book. So what we’ll do is we’ll go J build and Ryan, so So basically, last word, I’m gonna give it to you also J, go ahead.

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
On page

Unknown Speaker
443, I give away my bank account information, you’re welcome to buy a copy of the book, get to page 443. And that will get you access to all my bank accounts, you can take as much money as you’d like,

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
there you go. For your listeners out there, and the guys that are in that maximum lawyer group. If you I was very fortunate to have co authors that we worked really easily together. We felt that was probably the smoothest writing experience ever had we all felt accountable to each other. So I would thank them actually. And I would encourage your listeners and you guys to really think about, you know, getting a book together, not only to build credibility, but getting your own story out there. I think a book is a great idea. And I writing this book have made me realize that I like to see some of the guys in your group write books so that we can read them and gain knowledge from them. Just like we gain knowledge from Jim and Tyson and all the rest of the people in your group. So I would love to see other lawyers in practice, tell their stories.

Ryan
I mean, I talked about this in the book, I started my practice, I literally with $2,500, probably about $400 was pocket change that I put in a fishbowl that I had when I was a kid. And so money was always always an issue. And so I remember like, you know, $100 Jay Luneburg was like, out of the question. I did buy it, but it was it was like a hit that month. What we tried to do with this is, I mean, look, we’re not we’re we tried to write the book that we would want to give ourselves if we could go back in time. And in accordingly, like, we’re, we’ve priced it. I think the ebook is $9 999. And the softcover book is $19. And those are basically the minimums that Amazon would let us charge for a book of this size. So, you know, I think and I think one of the great joys that we’ve gotten all of us, we have a Facebook thread, where we, you know, we’ve been posting people’s comments, as they’ve reached out to us individually. And it means so much. I think, you know, that means more to me than depositing checks into my bank account, or, or things because the notion that we did this, to help other people and to contribute to a discussion that you guys do so well. And really, in your spirit, I always tell people, you know, everything that you ever need to know about running a law firm, just listen to Jim and Tyson and their podcasts. It’s all there. There’s no secrets, you can spend, you know, hundreds of 1000s of dollars going to seminars and coaches. It’s all in those podcasts. And I hope our book, sort of, you know, stands with you guys and helps add to that. Alright, guys,

Tyson Mutrux
we’re gonna wrap it up in a respectful your time before we do want to remind everyone ones are listening to this, go to the Facebook group, get involved there. Also go to iTunes, if you don’t mind, give us a five star review. So we help spread the love that helps help spread the love about the book and everyone else, everyone else helps contribute to this podcast. Jimmy, what is your hack of the week?

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
All right, so I’m a big believer in reading two books at once. So I’m reading Tiger tactics, while I’m also reading the latest book from Brene. Brown, and it’s called dare to lead. And when Ryan was talking about the things that are important to him, a lot of that resonated right out of that book, which I was reading this morning. And Renee Brown talks about how our job as business owners is to create a place where people will feel comfortable to take off their armor and be vulnerable. And I think that it’s a real message right now, I think that so many people are in a fighting stance, and to sort of just walk away from fights that don’t matter. To focus on connection is really, really powerful. It’s it’s a great book. Renee Brown,

Tyson Mutrux
she does really good. Read some really good books. I think she’s fantastic. So that’s a good recommendation. All right, so we’ll go Jay Ryan, Bill for your tip or hack of the week.

Unknown Speaker
So my tip really gets back to something that Jim brought up is that, you know, in the end, we’re in a people business. And one of the things you know, we are 13 days away for the from the end of the first quarter of 2019. I mean, I feel like the year just started. But we’re almost a quarter done, right. And so those goals that you had for yourself for the year, you got to be 25% of the way there otherwise, you’re behind the eight ball, right, you’re behind where you should be. One of the things that I really made a concerted effort to do this year is reach out to as many of my of my former colleagues that I had lost touch with. So I went out bought some cheap note cards. I got 1500 of them for around 300 bucks. From an online print shop. I just put my logo on them. And I’m trying to send out five to 10 a day. Hey, haven’t talked to you in a while your name came up or thought about this or remembered that. People I haven’t talked to you since law school people like us to be referral sources. And I’m just trying to reestablish that I’m here. And you know, how often do you get no cards personalized anymore? The only other mail I get is bills right now that you know and maybe my aunt Noel sends me a St. Patrick’s Day card with $5 in it. But really, you know, the personal connection is what you need to do and that’s that’s what I’m suggesting. Find a way pick up the phone and make some phone calls. Send some note cards just connect with people. We’re in a people business, talk to them. They everyone’s got Facebook in and all these digital ways to communicate, but we’re losing the human touch. And I’d like to encourage people to get back to that.

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
I’m going to give two.

Ryan
One is one is super simple. And that’s, if you can at all buy these Bose noise cancelling headphones, we bought them for office, they are huge increases of productivity, they cancel out all noise, they’re amazing on phone calls, they are comfortable as all heck, I think it’s the Bose 360 I don’t know, there they are, they are super fantastic. And probably my favorite bit of technology, we use them in the office, it really helps with with work and getting getting things done and making phone calls. It’s sort of life altering technology for for at least me. And my second. My second thing is maybe a little bit more serious. It’s you know, in the in the book, I mean, I talk a lot about various times where I’ve suffered from extreme anxiety times where I have, you know, you know, I It wasn’t drugs or alcohol, but I put on 50 pounds trying to grow my firm, it was sleepless nights, it was anxiety. And my biggest tip to anybody listening out there is reached out. Unfortunately, my wife said, you know, I think you should talk to somebody. And at the same time, literally, there was an article in the Latrobe unified employer who committed suicide. And there was a therapist who you’ve had on caring Caffrey on the podcast, and I reached out to her. And I think that that has made all the difference. I hopefully shared it in our book. But if you’re out there and you’re listening, and you’re suffering, you’re not alone, reach out.

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
Great advice.

Tyson Mutrux
Great advice, Bill,

Jay Ruane, Ryan McKeen, and Bill Umansky
which got for us. Ashley plugged to Jim hacking. You know, in this age of personal connection, it’s important to do a lot of videos, I would go through your if you’ve been a lawyer for a while, go through all your old videos. Look at the ones that didn’t work, awesome out, start over again. Look at Jim hackings videos day in and day out, don’t do him the way he does. And he’s got his own personality. And if you’re not good at shooting them, like I’m not hire a coach to coach you how to do videos. I’m stuck, I got a coach and I would, it’s accelerated the process to become better. And my goal is to have a huge subscription base. Hopefully next year, I’m starting to build that YouTube channel, starting next week, but I’ve been watching Jim Hansen’s videos. And that’s been really, really good. He lays it out there, how he does it, how we educate the audience, how he builds a connection. It’s unbelievable stuff. And I sometimes look at it, I want to act like Jim, but I know I can’t be like Jim. But his process of doing those videos regularly and pushing that out there. It’s incredible. And we should all be showcasing our personalities to develop relationships with people. And if you’re having a problem on video, hire a coach. That’s what I did. It’s been very, very helpful.

Tyson Mutrux
Alright, so first of all, no plugs for Jim are allowed. So we’re going to edit all of that out. And, you know, the success that Jim has has is because he leaves his shirt on bill so. So maybe to do all your videos, shirtless is a key part of it. So for my for my tip of the week, it’s actually about your book. And so I think at least the way I consume bullets and kind of devour these books, right? I go through and I read all of them. My advice is to read one chapter and let it sit down and think about it for a couple of days and then move on to the next chapter. Don’t just consume all of it. Because there’s there’s so much so much good advice in here. I think that if you just try to consume it in a day or two, you’re gonna miss a lot of great advice from these attorneys. So my advice is, read a chapter, let it sit for a day to digest it, think about it, and try to live the principles that they talked about, and then move on to the next chapter. So that’s my tip. Ryan, Bill. Jay, thanks so much for coming on. Unfortunately, couldn’t have your other links Billy and Teresa on. But you all were great. So thanks so much for coming on. Thank you. We’ll see. You guys.

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