3 Things We Have Learned from Running a Law Firm with Jim and Tyson


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Are you wanting to learn a few more law firm business tips? In this podcast episode, Jim and Tyson discuss what they have learned from each other about running a law firm. They talk about lessons learned and things both have implemented over their working relationship.

Jim speaks to the things he has learned from Tyson. One thing is the importance of incremental improvement. Many people feel they need to create the perfect formula or system to get things done. The reality is that improving a little bit each day or slowly working towards a goal little by little will truly get you far. Another thing Jim has learned is to systematize aspects of a firm for maximum efficiency. It is important to identify and invest in systems that will take your firm to the next level and make it the best it can be. This comes with streamlining processes or working with different technologies to make the client intake system better.

Jim continues with learning how to stop the “BS”, which is another thing that Tyson has inspired him to do. Many people struggle with doing what they know they need to do or do what they know is right. It could be fear of rejection or the fear of getting people mad. The reality is nothing will get done unless you do what needs to be done, regardless of who gets upset or if it fails.

Tyson shares how Jim is able to address and embrace the pain he has endured. Jim shares how Tyson is able to address, own and control the painful experiences of the past. A lot of people are not able to do this as it takes a certain level of awareness and strength to use it to one’s advantage. But, to use it as fuel and motivation when working with clients is very rewarding and makes you a better lawyer. Tyson also shares that he has learned the importance of taking a stance and position on things from Jim. Many people struggle with taking a strong stance on something they believe in. Tyson talks about how Jim does this very well in his marketing strategies to convey his message to potential clients. Doing this is not about making sure everyone likes you but about showing those that need your help that you are behind them.

Not caring about other people’s opinion is another thing that Tyson shares that he learned from Jim. This is another issue that people tend to do and it can cause people to minimize their growth and success. The truth is even if you don't believe it inside, saying it out loud can bring a sense of power to you that can then lead you to believing it. With this, it is important to surround yourself with people that matter and will support you through your career.

Take a listen to learn a few things from Jim and Tyson.

Episode Highlights:

  • 2:02 Focus on making small improvements each day 
  • 5:49 Embrace the pain in life
  • 8:15 Dedication to creating and implementing systems
  • 13:22 Exploration of the value of taking a position and not being afraid to be divisive

🎥 Watch the full video on YouTube here.


Transcripts: 3 Things We Have Learned from Running a Law Firm with Jim and Tyson

Speaker 1 (00:00:01) - Run your law firm the right way. The right way. This is the Maximum Lawyer podcast. Podcast. Your hosts, Jim Hacking and Tyson metrics. Let's partner up and maximize your firm. Welcome to the show.

Speaker 2 (00:00:24) - Welcome back to the Maximum Lawyer podcast. I'm Jim Hacking and.

Speaker 3 (00:00:27) - I'm Tyson Matrix. What's up Jimbo.

Speaker 2 (00:00:30) - How you doing my friend?

Speaker 3 (00:00:32) - I'm doing well. I've had a nice, productive day. Got a lot done. What about you?

Speaker 2 (00:00:38) - Well, we're supposed to be having our hot seat, but one of our members decided to reschedule. And so we've decided to record this podcast today, and I'm excited about the topic. I'm also excited about my new setup. Ken Richardson is back, and he's set up a kick ass studio for us here at Old hacking immigration law.

Speaker 3 (00:00:56) - Yeah, I like it. It looks very professional. The I don't know, like when I first popped on, it just it looks it looks really good. The only thing that's missing is like that, like big time professional set that you see in some of these podcasts these days.

Speaker 3 (00:01:11) - But no, it looks really good.

Speaker 2 (00:01:13) - We'll get there. We'll get there.

Speaker 3 (00:01:14) - At the end. Can't my way. He's going to come fly with me. So I'll pay him to set up my setup to be pretty good. Or hacking immigration can pay for it. I don't care, that's what off my back. All right, so, Jimmy, you have a topic for us today and thought it was a good one. And so I'll let you introduce what the topic is. But I'll tell you what. I wrote down three things I've learned from Jim. So introduce the topic for today.

Speaker 2 (00:01:40) - The topic was what are three things that we've learned from each other about running a law firm while we've been running this podcast. In other words, what are lessons that we've seen either something overt that happened or something that developed over time, and certainly mine. Most of mine are from things that I've just observed about you over time, so I thought it would make an interesting podcast topic for us today I did two.

Speaker 3 (00:02:02) - It really made me. It was interesting. I've always told you this, you, you do a much better job of like self reflection. But I did feel like today I was like in this like self reflection mode. And then we texted about the topic. And so I was like, sort of like, you caught me at a really good time because I was like, okay. It's like more of like a self reflection moment for me. So I was I was able to come up with some good, some good ones fairly easily. But I'm curious to hear what you come up with. But your topic, you go first. Let's hear it.

Speaker 2 (00:02:32) - Well, I just to your point, I think it's easier to think about what. We've learned from each other. It'd be funny if we did one. Things I've taught you over the last seven years. That would be. That would be a whole different one. But I think that it's easier to reflect on the things you've observed from your partner than maybe to reflect so much on yourself.

Speaker 2 (00:02:51) - But for my first one. One thing that I've learned from you, Tyson, is the value of incremental improvement. And so many people go for the home run and think that if I just designed the perfect system, if I just, you know, sit down and write out the perfect formula for whatever it is I'm trying to fix, instead of just sort of trying to improve it a little bit each day or each iteration. That's one of the things that I've really been impressed with. You and the way you work at your firm is you're. You're not afraid to just focus on small little things. You can do the big swings too, but day in and day out, I think you've gotten much further than most people because of your focus on just making things a little bit better.

Speaker 3 (00:03:36) - So yeah, I do agree. I'd say I'm probably good at that. The I think also have an uncanny ability to. And this sounds like I'm pat myself on the back, but I just it's just something I know about myself that I do think I've got an ability to look deep into the future, see things, and then break them down incrementally and then chip away at them over time.

Speaker 3 (00:04:01) - So I do think it comes from that, the ability to look deep, deep, deep into the future and then, okay, how we're going to get to that point. And so I do think a lot of it does does come from that part of of me. That's a that's an interesting observation.

Speaker 2 (00:04:15) - That's a real superpower too, because it's the a lot of people can figure out where things might be headed, but to to then be able to break it down and to start marching towards that, it makes me think of that Norman Schwarzkopf quote about just taking action that so many people way too long to take action and that they like. We really see a lot of people stymied by an inability to just start. Right. And so I think that's one thing that's been great about about metrics, injury law.

Speaker 3 (00:04:45) - Yeah. And about that, I mean, we I think, I think what we don't realize is that we've already started no matter where, like we've already started. It's just a matter of.

Speaker 3 (00:04:56) - Where is it taking you? Whatever you've started. Where is it? Where's that taking you? So you've already started something. It's just a matter of where you going? And once you figure out where you're going. And then you can start to figure out, okay, what are my next steps? So I do think we sometimes fail to realize that we've already started whatever it is, like we've already started our future. Now, how do we adjust course to get to where we're going to be? But let's, let's let's get to my first one. That way we have enough time with all these. It is this here's what I've learned from you. This is probably the number one thing. Address and embrace the pain you've endured in your life. It's you. You have an ability. It's something that I think that's why you're really, really good in these hot seats where you try to get to the pain, right? You try to get to people's pain. But I think one addressing it. So I chose these words very carefully.

Speaker 3 (00:05:49) - That's why I read it off my, my notes because you have to address it. Right. So you have to acknowledge the fact that it's there and address it. But then it's happened. Whatever the pain is in your life and then you embrace it and you, you own it, so you control it. Once you've owned it, you can you can control it. And so you've done you've taken past events from your life. You've addressed them, you've embraced them, and you've used that in your story and you've used that to really, I'd say, propel you to where you want to be.

Speaker 2 (00:06:21) - Yeah. I mean that's that's a great point. And and it takes a lot of work to be able to even be in that kind of a situation. So I appreciate the comment. I do think that I use what's happened to me in the past as fuel, and I think that there's a motivator there, a motivating factor there that really makes me want to push through. And, and, you know, a lot of times, Tyson, I view what I do with immigrants and what I do with lawyers with you.

Speaker 2 (00:06:50) - Similarly, in that I view a big part of what I do is trying to help ease people's suffering. And I think it takes suffering to appreciate the suffering of others and to commiserate with them. And so I think it makes me a more empathetic lawyer. It makes me, you know, it drives me also, you know. It helps me spot foes and then work against those foes. And so I do. It does lead me, I think, to look at the world in a little bit of a more black and white thing, and to the good and the bad of that. But I do think that tapping into that can be really powerful. And if you haven't done the work to look at your traumas, I think that it could really hold you back.

Speaker 3 (00:07:38) - Yeah, I heard this. I heard this really good. It was not a quote, but it was a phrase. And maybe this is a common one. I've never heard it, but it's a bear with me here because I'm trying to remember exactly how it went.

Speaker 3 (00:07:48) - But, like, if you think of a slingshot, the farther you've been held or the more you've been held back, the farther you can go. And I don't know if I 100% agree with that, but I think for people that have have been through some sort of trauma or have had setbacks, I think you can use that as motivation. If you think about it like a slingshot where the father, you've been held back or pulled back the farther you can go. I do think it's a really fun one that you can use to to propel yourself into the future.

Speaker 2 (00:08:15) - The second thing that I've learned from you that I outlined is systematize, systematize, systematize. And then when you're done, systematize some more. And I think that, you know, we've those of us who've attended all the Max Lacan's have seen your design books and know you've always been very generous sharing your systems with other people. Obviously when we worked on maximum law, minimum time for the guild that we were, we looked at each other's systems.

Speaker 2 (00:08:45) - And I just know that you, you automatically default almost to systems and and that probably goes part and parcel with the first thing that you said about incremental improvement and breaking things down. So you invest a lot in systems. And I think that's the right way to frame it. Investing a lot in systems because it is an investment. And I'm working right now on some things with my team. And I can I can see where if we do X amount of hours now on the front end, that it's going to pay off X to the X degree later on in the fact that people are going to be able to work faster and easier and cut down on mistakes.

Speaker 3 (00:09:32) - You know, I think I think where this comes from is what it goes back to the first one because and whenever I'm talking to employees to where I tell them, like, what we're building is something for the future. And so it's something where I'm always I'm always kind of thinking about that, okay, so let's build this now and then as we continue to build it and build it and build it, what we can do is we can we can tweak things as we go.

Speaker 3 (00:09:55) - But just my viewpoint is, is that like if we're going to if we're going to set up some sort of process or do something, we're going to be doing it again and again and again. So let's go and build a process for it, system for it. And then that we're building it on to this machine that we're building. And then that's kind of where I view it. It's like we're kind of building this machine and we're building, as it were, as we're going. And I think that that's probably where that comes from. You asked me that before. I remember a long time ago you said, do you think that's because you were in the military? And I don't think it has anything to do at all with the with the military background at all. I don't necessarily know where that came from, but I don't think it was military. But yeah, that's I think that probably sums me up pretty well.

Speaker 2 (00:10:35) - Tyson, how do you know when you've systematized enough? I think that's something too, that some people might go to another extreme, like how granular do you get it? How, you know, systematized can you be and can you be over systematized? I guess is the question 100%.

Speaker 3 (00:10:51) - I learned that from you. That's not one. That's my bonus. That's a bonus one I remember early on. So I think I take two things away from you and from the two things I take away. It's from you and from Jason Self. The first one is, is I always think back to your first Infusionsoft setup that you had paid someone to build out, and you couldn't use it because it was too complicated. And so I think about that, and I also think about it from the user's perspective, which the user is our employees, our teammates. So you have to think about, okay, from their perspective, how is this going to work. And so to answer your question, yes. But the other thing is like simpler is almost always better. If you think about many of the websites that you've gone to or like I'm talking about anything, we're at the login to it and use the thing. Whatever the thing is, it's almost always way better if it has less bells and whistles, like if you like, if you were to go to like.

Speaker 3 (00:11:47) - So anyone that uses case text right now, they've got a really cool thing called co-counsel, by the way. You check it out. But if you compare that to Lexis, so you over Westlaw, you open theirs up and you compare them. It is very simple. It's a very simple user interface, right? It's very, very simple. And you just go in. I mean, it's it's you don't have all these different links that you can click on when you're in there. So when you're in there you do the business, you get out. You don't need to. Do all these other things and all they have all these other bells and whistles. And so I you should probably, whenever you all are designing things for your firms, whatever the system or process is, it should be. With that in mind, think about the end user. Who's the end user. If it's you, great. Make it very simple. But most people are not going to want something really, really complicated.

Speaker 3 (00:12:31) - They're going to want something that's very simple. It does the thing that you that you needed to do, and you don't need a bunch of other things for it because all the other other, all the other bells and whistles, you rarely use those things. And that's something that I've learned over time, is that you think you need all these additional things, and you don't really need all these additional things. They're there for the one off that you use maybe once a year. You don't use them on a regular basis. So design it with simplicity in mind.

Speaker 2 (00:12:55) - You're listening to the Maximum Lawyer podcast, our topic today, three things that we've learned from each other. Tyson's going to share the second thing that he thinks he's learned from me.

Speaker 3 (00:13:04) - So my second one, the second thing I've learned from you is to put your flag in the ground and take a position. And this was something that's something that still is very hard for me to do where you will. It does not matter what it is you will take.

Speaker 3 (00:13:22) - And I think this is part of this is your personality, where you will go to one extreme. And I'm not talking about that, just generally how you will, you will sometimes or many times jump to one extreme, but you are not afraid to go to that extreme, you know, put your stake in the ground and take a position, and you use that in your marketing really, really well, where you take a position and you're not really afraid of hurting people's feelings. And I think that is a very powerful thing. And it's something that you can it allows you to strengthen your message and and improve your marketing. And I think people I think some people may not like you for it, but I think the majority of people will like you for it because you're you're willing to stand up and take that take that position.

Speaker 2 (00:14:03) - When I went to an early Ben Glass presentation, one of the things he said, the worst thing you can do in marketing is be boring, which I think is true.

Speaker 2 (00:14:10) - But also, you know, it's nice for me because I'm authentic in what I say that I like and what I don't like. But also, you know, Seth Godin and Tribes, which is one of the first books I read. When I opened up, the firm was very adamant that if you try to make everybody happy, you're not going to make anybody happy and you're certainly not going to stand out. And so. When I looked at immigration as an issue, and I realized that 30% of people will always love what I do, and 30% of people will always hate what I do. Then I don't need to worry about those 30% who are going to hate us for what we do. So just focus on the 30% that love us and the 30% that are open to what we do or need us. Try not to antagonize them so much, but by taking a position, you make the people that agree with you love you that much more, and otherwise they're just going to think you're a cog.

Speaker 2 (00:15:04) - And so for me, I'm lucky I have a platform. I came. I came into owning a law firm at a time when technology made spreading a message really easy. I happen to have a message that I believe in and that that I can easily tap into. And so sort of all those things combined to put me where I am now, I think.

Speaker 3 (00:15:23) - Okay, so the the willingness to do it, the ability to do it, it is I think it's a really hard thing to do because you for I'll use I'll use Trump as an example. Right. That's a very divisive thing. He's a very divisive person. But in your immigration emails and in a lot of your messaging, you you don't worry about taking a position on some of the things that he's done or even with President Biden. It doesn't matter what the president, who the president is, but you're willing you're willing to go to one side or the other. And I think that that would offend a lot of people. So I guess, what is your message to people, whether it's personal injury or estate planning? Because when it comes to personal injury, a rarely am I going to be attacking the president of United States, but I might be attacking a local representative for pitching tort reform or something like that.

Speaker 3 (00:16:16) - It might be doing that, but, you know, becomes a state planning theme. A lot of things like that. You don't have those boogeymen like you do sometimes with personal injury, but especially not with immigration. So what is your advice to people when it comes to taking that position, taking that, that stand on one side or the other? And I'm not talking about politics, but just anything. How can you convince someone or how would you? What would you say to someone that is afraid of breaking out of their shell and taking a position and defending one side or the other?

Speaker 2 (00:16:42) - Think about Thanos. How many members of the Avengers did it take to defeat Thanos? It took about 7 or 8 Avengers to beat Thanos, right? So in my in my mind, you almost have to have a villain to fight against, right? You almost have to have someone, and it should be legitimate, right? So you've got to have someone to market against, and the power and strength of the villain raises the power and strength of the hero.

Speaker 2 (00:17:15) - Right? So what what I like to do is to think about, you know, who am I fighting against? Who am I fighting for? And how can I accentuate the power and strength of the villain so that on the rare occasions when they're able to be vanquished and I'm the one doing it, I'm the hero, right? So it's all legit. Like I don't purposely calculate to do that, but I think that it just sort of coincide naturally. And then of course, when it comes to immigration, I couldn't have come up with a villain who said the things that they said about immigration, that Trump said. So if it's someone in a generic practice area, I think I would be obsessed. If I'm doing estate planning, I would be obsessed and I would talk about all the time the evil that happens when Mom or dad dies and the government gets all your all your money through taxes like I would. I would be talking about that all the time. I'd be pounding. You got to pound the villain almost more than you pound yourself, you know? And so and obviously for you, it'd be insurance companies and these out-of-town lawyers that want to come in and put up these billboards and think, you're so stupid, Mr. and Mrs. Missourian, that you're going to go to this guy in Florida who doesn't know a goddamn thing about the way courts work in Missouri.

Speaker 2 (00:18:26) - And I would just be marketing against him every single day.

Speaker 3 (00:18:30) - Oh. Very interesting, I like that. For those of you listening, I would rewind that a couple of times and take some notes. That was good advice. I was skeptical when you started with us, but you sold me, so that's that's good, I like it. All right. So go to your third one.

Speaker 2 (00:18:46) - My third topic that things that you taught me again, it goes back to one of our maximum lawyer events. And I think of you sitting up on stage with your feet hanging off the end of the stage, and you talked about stopping the bus. Stopping the bus, and I come, I come back to that and to bill you. Minsky's flip it like a pancake. Often when it comes to stopping the bus, I think that so many of us spend so much time talking ourselves out of doing the things that we know we need to do, that when you get a clarion call like stop the bus, it just sort of like a knife through butter makes it very clear that so much of what we tell ourselves on a day to day basis ends up being negative or bad or not, something we need to even be thinking about.

Speaker 2 (00:19:36) - And so, you know, you can talk yourself into things that you shouldn't be doing. You can talk yourself out of doing the things that you need to do. And what really you need to do is just stop the bus and do what you know in your heart of hearts actually needs to be done.

Speaker 3 (00:19:50) - You know, it's funny. I've not thought about that presentation in a long time. This this is a good, good walk down memory lane for me. Yeah. The I think we think sometimes I need to tell myself that a little bit more than what I, what I do, there's there's something out there. I think there's an extension on this too is like stop, stop believing your to. I think there's follow up speech on that too. But because sometimes you start to believe your own BS and that's, that's a dangerous thing too. But I do find it interesting, the number of people that we've talked to over the last seven, eight years, I don't know what we're at this point.

Speaker 3 (00:20:24) - Is it seven years? I always get this wrong. Seven years. All right, all right. So last seven years. And how many of them know the answer to whatever it is that they're looking for, whatever solution they're looking for, they know. They know what the solution is. And for whatever reason, they won't do it. And I think sometimes they just they need a wake up call like you want to shake them. And that was the point of that, that whole the whole speech was like to shake, shake a few people. That's why. That's why I said what I said, because sometimes people will go to a conference and listen to these things and, you know, great, I'm going to do these things. But I did use the colorful language that I did to wake some people up, because I think, I think sometimes people need that. You need the wake up call. Stop, stop messing around. Take the actions you need to take or stop doing the things that that you say you shouldn't be doing and just move on.

Speaker 3 (00:21:15) - Like quit doing those things. So that's a good walk. Good walk down memory lane, Jimbo. All right, so let's get to my last one. And mine the last one. It's I actually had to break these two down because I they are different. And it's similar to the last one. But I did want to make sure I completely took it out and made it separate because we already sort of talked about this, but because we talked about putting your flag in the in the ground and taking a position. But there's a second part to this. You talked about it a little bit, but it's don't worry about what people think about you. And I've heard you you've and here's the thing, I don't know if you truly care about what people think about you, but I get like from my viewpoint, it seems like you just don't give a damn at all what people think. Like I've heard you say, who cares? Like I've heard you. I've heard you say them like that. But it's it's like, you know what? That's right.

Speaker 3 (00:22:07) - Every time you say it, I'm like, you know what? That's right. Who cares? Like why? Like, why do I care what they think? And so that is one of those things where, like, I'm still bad about it, but especially early on in my life, like, I cared about way too much about what people thought like way, way too much about what what people thought about me. And so I think you make decisions that don't that aren't necessarily in your best interests. When you do that, you you do things that are in the best interest of those people as opposed to what's in the best interest for you and your family. And so I think the ability to do that is really powerful. And so I have tried to do more of that. We're not I don't really give a damn what other people think. And sometimes I'll say it, I won't really believe it, but at least saying it gives me a little bit more power in in controlling what the message is.

Speaker 2 (00:22:59) - Well, here's what I'll say about that. Number one is I am ten or so years older than you. So I think with age comes some of that caring less about what other people think. Number two, I definitely do like people to like me. And I definitely do things that I think increase the chances of people liking me. But I believe the world is such a big place that my job is to find the people that already like me, or are already inclined to like me, as opposed to trying to convince these other people to like me. So I think that's. That's maybe where the power comes in is like, I'm sort of like an I'm sort of like an open invitation to like me. But if you don't like me, that's okay. I'm not for everybody. And so that's sort of that might be a little bit of a, of a distinction that I might say with what you say, because everybody wants to be liked. And I, and I definitely do a lot of stuff to help people.

Speaker 2 (00:23:48) - And part of that is to, I think because I have those same insecurities and want people to like me, but also part of it is just, you know, you have to let go of the result. You just do your best. You build your tribe, you build your audience, and then you just see what happens.

Speaker 3 (00:24:02) - There is this and this is this is supposed to be my tip of the week, but I want to ask you about it. So there was a there's a podcast episode that is really good that just came out. I think it just came out. I just now watched it. But it's a guy named Mike Williamson, I think is his name, and he interviewed Rickroll and he talked about how he had he, he had started to create these relationships with people and these these relationships were the I'm going to tell the short story of this. Essentially, these were the people he didn't really want to be around. And these were these were actually like, he was that person, like the people he didn't want to be around was he was that person.

Speaker 3 (00:24:41) - And he didn't realize that the way he was acting was attracting the people that he didn't want to be around. And so he's like, spent the last several years, you know, trying to be the person he wanted to be, the person that he wanted to be around. So I want to get your thoughts on based on what you just said, what are your thoughts on that and how how have you been able to surround yourself with the people that you surround yourself with?

Speaker 2 (00:25:06) - Well, you do have to actively distance yourself from people that you don't want to be around or the types of people you don't want to be around. So I think there's there has to be some conscious decision making going on about, you know, is this the kind of is this the way I want to spend my time, my limited time, or are these the people that I want to spend my time with? I mean, I think within our firm, we've assembled a lot of people that we like being with, and I think that's really important.

Speaker 2 (00:25:31) - I think, I think also. That in a way, we become energy. And we and we, we attract people that are similar. So I definitely think that if you're in touch with who you are and comfortable with who you are, that eventually you just sort of put out into the world this energy that people latch on to and like and want to be around. So I think that's I think that's definitely true.

Speaker 3 (00:25:57) - Very good. All right. Well that was my third. You've done your three. Any last words before we wrap this baby up?

Speaker 2 (00:26:05) - Nope. I just think we're lucky to have had this time together. And I think that we've learned a lot from each other. And I actually think that we sort of balance each other out. You know, you you pointed out about how I say a lot of things and sometimes they're sort of on the extreme. And one of the great things about your friendship is that every now and then I go a little too far and I get a little nudge from old Tyson saying, are you sure you want to say that you.

Speaker 3 (00:26:28) - Got a really? Yeah, in a little bit every once in a while. But everyone, that's the thing. We all need a little bit of an anchor to bring is back in. All right. So let's wrap things up before I do. I do have another tip since I use my use my my one up. But I've got another tip before I do get to my tip and Jimmy's hack, I want to remind everyone join us in the big old Facebook group Search Maximum Lawyer inside of Facebook. And then if you want a higher level conversation, join us in the Guild. Go to Max Law guild.com. And we've got our quarterly mastermind coming up. And so if you want to join us and for one of those quarterly masterminds, make sure you join us in the Guild. That's another one of the benefits of joining Jimmy. What is your tip or your hack of the week? I mean, what's your hack of the week?

Speaker 2 (00:27:10) - As you know, I've read Atomic Habits several times and I've never gotten around to Charles Duhigg The Power of Habit.

Speaker 2 (00:27:16) - It has a little bit more of the science behind habit formation, and the anecdotes and the science in the book make it a worthy companion to atomic habits. I'd still put atomic habits up above, but I think that anytime you can talk about how to develop good habits or break bad habits, that's all time well spent.

Speaker 3 (00:27:35) - Love it, love it. Another book to put on our bookshelves and jeez, I'll never I will never read all the books that I want to read my entire life, but I will do my best trying. So I'm going to do my best to explain this. But I was it was weird. I stumbled on a Ted talk of of one comedian and then it led to another. I was I was doing some work in the yard and then automatically played. It was on YouTube, automatically play a Ted talk for from another comedian. And there was a guy named it's Michael Junior, Mike junior, Michael Junior, and he's a clean comic. He's I've actually seen some of the stuff before.

Speaker 3 (00:28:09) - I can't tell you where, but he was talking about how he like he's big into charity. So every time they go and do some sort of stand up, he then does some sort of volunteering in that town and I think it's really cool. But he was talking about how comedians, what they have is they've got the setup and then they've got the punch line, and then in exchange for the punch line, they get laughter. So they receive laughter. And and he said that there was some moment in his career where he it just he had an epiphany where he instead of, instead of like getting up there just to get that superficial laugh. Right. He because he was he wasn't particularly happy. He was. I think he was in a pretty bad spot, I think, at the time. And he said, you know, instead of getting up there just to get that laugh, what if I get up and give them the opportunity to laugh? And I thought it was a really when he said it, I was like, it instantly made sense to me where it's like, oh, and it was funny because what I, where I initially took it was, okay, when I'm settling these cases and I'm dealing with these insurance companies and these these defense attorneys, and I'm dealing with the other side of the defendant, like, I'm actually like instead of less like trying to go and get the settlement cheque, let's, let's give them the opportunity to actually try to resolve this case.

Speaker 3 (00:29:31) - We don't have to put our client through it. We don't have to put them through it. And it did. It was interesting because it changed my mindset, a lot of things. And the same thing applies to whenever it comes to dealing with our clients. And it really anyone. You can imply that we're okay. I'm giving something and it's just a mindset shift. I'm going to give you the opportunity to give me a laugh. Right. So or I'm sorry, I'm going to give you the opportunity to laugh. And I do think it was a really interesting way of putting it. And it makes it instead of you just going out there to get that superficial thing like so instead of us, you know, going out there just to settle that check or settle that case, just to get a check. Instead, we are we're, we're doing this and it's going to give the clients the opportunity to get their lives back on track, recover from their injuries. It's going to allow them to, you know, maybe maybe they can because they, they they had a really serious injury.

Speaker 3 (00:30:22) - Maybe this is going to give them the opportunity to to do something better for their children or for their, for their spouse or whatever it may be. But I thought it was a very, very important message. So for anyone that wants to watch it go to. Look it up on Ted talks and Mike think his name's Michael Junior, so really good. All right, Jimbo, that's a fun episode. Good talking to you. We went a little bit long, but no worries as always. Great talking to you. And for anybody that this is on YouTube. Check out Jim's new setup. It looks real.

Speaker 2 (00:30:47) - All right, buddy.

Speaker 3 (00:30:47) - All right, man, good talking to you.

Speaker 1 (00:30:51) - Thanks for listening to the Maximum Lawyer podcast. Stay in contact with your hosts and to access more content. Go to Maximum lawyer.com. Have a great week and catch you next time.

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