How can you get good publicity relatively easy and cheap to help your business.
In this episode, Jim and Tyson will go through a list of 6 strategies to get good and relatively easy and cheap publicity.
1. Reach out to reporters and develop a relationship before you need a story put out there.
2. Support a cause. REALLY support it.
3. Write a book.
4. Start a podcast!
5. Issue press releases.
6. Do a CLE!
And there’s a BONUS!
KEEP HUSTLING. Keep doing things, keep meeting people, keep marketing, keep networking; KEEP DOING!
Hacking’s Hack: A podcast. Perpetual Traffic. Mostly devoted to social media strategies and advertising. Check it out: http://www.digitalmarketer.com/podcast/
Tyson’s Tip: An app. Lucidchart. Diagram things very easily. Easy to use. https://www.lucidchart.com
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Transcripts: Easy Publicity
Tyson Mutrux
Well, yeah, and you call it luck. There is some sort of luck involved in this. But I mean, you’ve been hustling for a long time, even creating all these connections. It’s all about that. You’ve got to keep doing something, you’ve got to have a plan moving forward. And you do that. So it’s really not a whole lot of luck involved. I think you, I think you just work hard. And so I think that’s a big part of it. People have to keep moving and keep doing things, keep marketing, keep meeting people keep networking, whatever it may be. So
Unknown Speaker
run your law firm the right way. This is the maximum liar podcast via podcast, your hosts, Jim hacking and Tyson metrics. Let’s partner up and maximize your firm. Welcome to the show.
Jim Hacking
You’re back on the maximum lawyer Podcast. I’m Jim hacking.
Tyson Mutrux
And I’m tasting metrics with Jimmy. Oh, Jason,
Jim Hacking
it’s been a good week. haven’t talked to you much this week. I know you’ve got a lot cooking with Infusionsoft and we’re excited about our upcoming trip to iKON. But before that, I’m going to be taking the boys very soon. Of course, by the time our listeners hear this, I’ve already gone. But we’re going to go down to spring training and to Craig golden Farbe, seven figure attorney Summit. So I’ll be reporting maybe live from there. I’m also thinking about starting a maximum lawyer book club book of the month, or you know, where we can talk about business books or things that we like, and I thought that would be fun for the
Tyson Mutrux
group. Great idea. A lot of listeners would like, great idea.
Jim Hacking
How are you doing?
Tyson Mutrux
I’m good. Just been busy like that. I can’t talk about all the details. But we’ve been talking about Infusionsoft and stuff. And so got some possibly some really interesting things to announce in the coming week. Yeah, things are going pretty well.
Jim Hacking
Alright, so this week’s episode is focused on publicity, and how our listeners and attorneys can get publicity relatively easily and cheaply. You know, we live in this day where our telephones can broadcast us live around the world. It’s pretty amazing when you stop and think about it when you’re an old fart like me. And you remember back, you know, when you had a rotary dial telephone, and you know, if somebody wanted to get publicity, they had to pay an ad agency to try to get them some publicity in the newspaper or on television. And it’s just a completely different world right now. So we thought we would talk about six strategies that our listeners can use to get some publicity. Yeah. And I think it’s a really good
Tyson Mutrux
idea. Because what it does is it makes you more credible, right? You become some public figure of sorts, and whether it’s a book or some other things, I think you’re going to talk about that a little bit, but it really makes you more credible, increases your credibility, which is great.
Jim Hacking
Yeah. And it’s just so easy now to do it. So let’s dive right in the first step that that I had was to reach out to reporters and develop a relationship before you need a story put out there. And what do I mean by that? Well, like this morning, I was in the car, listening to NPR on the way in, and there was a really nice report. And it was very balanced. I thought about the h1 B program, which is the employment visa program. And you know, with the president running on sort of an American first campaign, the h1 B visa, which is the way that most foreign nationals work in the United States, that program is up for some increased scrutiny, to say the least. And so the reporter did a really nice job. And so I sent her an email today telling her what a great job that she did. And you know, obviously, I’ve immigration in my signature page, and I’m an immigration attorney. And I predict that at some point down the line, she’ll reach out back to me and get comments and things that I’ve done that many times, there’s people I’ve developed actual friendships with from the post dispatch and other local media that all started with a retweet of something that they did or just a nice job, shout out and social media about something, it’s really easy. And it goes towards the value in taking the long view, you know, so often we want people to do things for us and to promote our stuff, but we don’t promote their stuff. And it’s just a really easy, you know, givers gain approach to developing media contacts, both locally and around the country.
Tyson Mutrux
Yeah, you told me early on that, just go and email, email them either tell them that their article is great, or asking the question or something like that. And I’ve been doing that I’ve been doing that for a while. Now. You Right? Definitely dissolve these contacts with people go to the bottom of their article from the top, depending on which website you go to read the article gets their web, their email address, and shoot them an email real quick is super easy. And next thing you know, they’re contacting you about a news story or something else. And so that’s, that’s a great way to develop those relationships. It’s not going to happen overnight. It’s going to be just something very, very simple. Usually, to start off with, you got to build that relationship, but then they will start contacting you.
Jim Hacking
I made a comment on Facebook, not too long ago, and one of those reporters reached out to me and asked me a couple of questions about tort reform. So it definitely works. And so I think that you are really good about getting those mentions in those articles. And reporters are just like everybody else, you know, they liked it. know that people are reading and listening to what they do. And they like positive reinforcement, and they like to know that their work is appreciated. And the other thing about the newspaper and radio and television is those reporters, they have a hole that they have to fill every day or every other day where they’re on the hook for coming up with a story. And a lot of times, once you develop that relationship, I’ve had this happen numerous times where they just sort of email me or call me and say, Hey, Jim, do you have anything interesting that we could do a story on, you know, you’re helping them out. But obviously, they’re helping you out too. And I think that it doesn’t take long for that relationship to develop, if you’re doing it the right way.
Tyson Mutrux
Something I didn’t realize until you told me that some of these articles are written by other people, the vast majority of them are submitted by other people, they go to the reporter, the reporter puts their twist on it. And then it’s done. It’s edited and everything else. So that’s another option is possibly talking to a reporter, reporting your own little write up of something and see if they want to use it. So that’s another way of doing it. But I wouldn’t do that until you’ve got some sort of report built that reporter because they’re not gonna just can take whatever you give them. So number two, is really support a cause, and really support the cause don’t just plug something worthy cause Mike Campbell did something with his DUI campaign where he bought so many rides for people on New Year’s Eve, and it worked really, really well. He got a lot of publicity in Columbia, Missouri for it, that’s a really good one. Miss Jackson also has a distracted driving campaign that he supports. And I done something a couple years ago were a client of mine had been severely injured. And so we did this fundraiser for him. And that got some publicity out of it as well. So there are these things that you do that are not to support your practice, they’re actually to support other causes. And that makes a big difference. And you can get a lot of publicity out of that.
Jim Hacking
Yeah. And I think when it’s something that’s comes from your heart, and it’s a well intentioned thing, and you’re not just doing it for publicity, but you’re really trying to bring about change, I mean, that situation you had on Facebook with that boy who I remember, had the helmet, and I don’t remember what his malady was, but you really took that on as a cause. And it makes lawyers bigger than just themselves and bigger than just at chest pounding, talking about how great they are in boring legal stuff. It’s something that really is bigger than them. And it’s something that people can get excited about. And you’re also networking with all the people in that sort of world, whatever the diseases that you’re focusing on, or the causes that you’re focusing on, I think that it just makes that we seem more human, as lawyers and as people running a law firm.
Tyson Mutrux
Yeah, and some attorneys need more head more than others. So it can always be somebody definitely make you relate to people. So what’s your number three.
Jim Hacking
Alright, so number three is something that we talked about on this show a lot. And we’ve had guests on the show, including one of our number one fans, John Fisher, and that is, you know, write a book. And there are many ways to write a book, John is working on his second book. And it’s coming out, we’re real excited about that. Our friend, Kurt Lloyd, wrote a book Kurt’s from the mastermind up in Chicago. And you know, he’s a trial lawyer. And what he did is he realized that there was a gap in the literature in Illinois when it comes to jury instruction. So he decided to set out and he wrote The Definitive Guide on jury instructions. I don’t think this is the title, but it’s basically void on jury instruction. So you know, what a calling card that is, to be able to give to all kinds of trial attorneys, you know, he like John Fisher gets most of his referrals from other attorneys. So to be the wise man or woman at the top of the mountain top, who has the information about what you need, I mean, you know, people are gonna be looking at that book every day. It’s something that has real value. The other thing with books is, again, with so much of what we talk about when it comes to media is how easy it is to create a book right now. So I’ve gone through a process twice now called the 90 Minute Book by, you know, my hero, Dean Jackson, he has a whole little company now, that basically interviews you for an hour, and then records it transcribes it and turns it into a book. And so we’re really drilling down on discrete legal issues. And we’re just creating little mini books, as lead magnets for our website. So there’s a real spectrum that you can do, you know, John Fisher’s book was very detailed, and it’s instructive to lawyers on how to build systems in their law firms. And that’s obviously very helpful for a lot of younger attorneys and older attorneys. But you know, you can use a book and create a book in many different ways. And it really goes a long way to establishing your credibility when you get introduced on the media. You’re the author of that book. And you know, author is the basis of the word authority. So there really is no substitute. I think that having a book with your, your name and your grill on it.
Tyson Mutrux
Yeah, if people are having problems doing a book, I mean, you and I talked on a few podcasts ago about the idea of having someone else interview you something else you can also do is Ryan Deiss has this thing at his website release he used to a while back, where he’s got the little formula of how to write your own book. It’s actually pretty cool where you list like 12 topics on an index card on the back of the index card. Each one of those index cards you write down like sub count categories. And all you do is you write about 250 to 500 words, like each one of those things, or you can dictate it, it’s actually a really easy way of doing it. That’s how I got mine started. And you’re gonna help me finish my with interview. So there’s really easy ways of doing it. Or you can hire companies like the Jackson company, and they take care of it for you. So and then also, did you self publish? Or how did you publish it?
Jim Hacking
No. So that’s part of the deal is they give you 50 copies, they set you up with Amazon creative space, and then whenever you need new books, one you can edit it into, you can just order them really easily takes about two weeks for for another set of books to come.
Tyson Mutrux
Okay, cuz I was gonna say create spaces a spot where people can go and self publish. So there’s, there’s plenty of tools out there these days where you can get your own book out there. Alright, and number four would be to start a podcast. So that was not the idea was not to get a bunch of publicity with this never given I started this, but we knew we’d be able to reach out to a lot of other attorneys with doing this and provide something of value. And so we’ve been doing, we’ve had people from all across the country contact us, which has been really cool. We’ve met some really awesome guests on this. But it’s gotten us a lot of exposure, which is great. I’d casting is big these days. It’s not something that’s small anymore. It’s most people know about podcasting. Obviously, if you’re listening to this, you know about that. But it is super easy to start a podcast, Jim and I can probably do an episode on that some time in the future. But podcasting is super simple. It’s very easy to do. It’s an easy way to reach out to your clients, to other attorneys, to people in general, you want to support a cause, like we talked about before, you can podcast about that there are a lot of easy ways of doing it. And podcasting has been great for both Jim and I. All right.
Jim Hacking
I agree. I’ve enjoyed the podcast recording with you. And I think that it definitely builds our stature a little bit. And I think people come up to us and say, Hey, I heard you on the podcast, and there’s just no substitute to having your voice conveyed to someone. I think that it’s different than the website. It’s different than video. You know, people listen to podcasts when they’re in their car, when they’re exercising when they’re, you know, running errands or folding laundry. And I think it really helps build a connection with people in a way that most other mediums do not.
Tyson Mutrux
That’s right, so what is your number five.
Jim Hacking
So for number five, my tip is to issue press releases. And so, you know, sometimes we do things that are noteworthy and press releases are sort of old school, we do still send them by fax and email. But you can compile a pretty quick list of all the major media outlets in your city. And you can do it all by email now. And you can just sort of do a blast, you know, like I said, the media has a hole that they need to fill in. If you’re doing something noteworthy and interesting, then I think they’re going to want to hear about it. And then press releases just a really easy way. It still works. When I filed one of my lawsuits against the immigration service, I did a press release. And I did a little press conference down on the steps of the federal courthouse, and two television stations and two radio stations and the newspaper all came to hear me talk and so you know, that was then page three story in the newspaper and it was on all the media. So it’s it really the way it still works doing press releases.
Tyson Mutrux
Now, what I found is that the best way to issue the press release is issued directly to the new source right now you can you can pay these other sources, but it’s pretty expensive. They give out to everybody. But what I found is the easiest way is actually send it straight to the sources do you find the same thing,
Jim Hacking
I’ve never used one of those other listing services, I just do it myself, people read it, there’s no reason to go through one of those people, they’ll get it and they’ll either act on it or they won’t.
Tyson Mutrux
All right, so let’s move on to the last one. And then you’ll have a bonus. The last one is to do a CLE. I’ve been doing CLS for about four years. So the Missouri bar, and they sent out a publication the month before the Cle actually launches. And so my name is in the publication, my picture on the publications, they plug it for me. And then whenever I’m actually teaching the Cle that’s also another credibility booster. And I also never have a plug myself on at the beginning of the Cle. So I give them a bio. And so because the podcast is starting to take off, I’m teaching for SEO Leads over the next five months, and I’m gonna have them plugged the podcast each CLE. So that’s another way of just sort of boosting your credibility in a fairly, I would say it’s a unique way, but it’s a it’s a way where it’s a pretty easy way to doing. And honestly, early on, I just signed up as a Missouri bar to become a speaker. They needed me and so they end up contacting pretty quickly. So it’s an easy way, at least in Missouri to do it.
Jim Hacking
That’s awesome. And I haven’t done a ceiling in a while but I think that any kind of public presentation I know that we both attended and spoke at our friend Gary burgers sort of personal CLE that was one thing that he did. And another thing that I’m working on right now is I’m putting together a CLE as a fundraiser for my old high school and my old high school I think geez, about 10% of the people that go there are lawyers. So there’s a huge group of people that are potential attendees that that’s the only I’m going to be He’s a moderator of it. And it’s gonna be an all day thing in June. And I think it’s a real opportunity to get yourself out there even if you’re just moderating, but just putting it together and being the point person really sort of, again, holds you out there as an authority,
Tyson Mutrux
right. And even if you can’t teach the Cle, for some reason, let’s say you just can’t get the gig for whatever reason, contact your law school and speak to the students about running a law practice or starting law practice or being an associate. There’s lots of ways out there for you to speak to people. And even if you’re not thinking about a CLE, speak, I mean, speaking is a great way of putting yourself out in front of people. Good buddy, my Matt Vianello. He’s actually just coordinated a thing with a bunch of communities in the city of St. Louis, where they’re speaking about the court plan, because most people don’t understand what the court plan is in Missouri. It’s under attack. And so he’s he’s organized a bunch of speakers. He’s digging himself, he’s also organized a bunch of speakers to go out and speak to the people. And so you get all of that credibility, you get all that boost, you get all that sort of people with their eyeballs on you. And guess what else you get to do, you get to hand out business cards to them. So there are ways of getting yourself out there. And it’s pretty easy. It’s free. I mean, it doesn’t cost you a thing. It’s free marketing. And so it’s just about the house. Okay, get the house.
Jim Hacking
And there’s one more tip I might throw in there. So I’ve been doing a lot of speaking to people that are concerned about the immigration situation, I’ve given talks at local mosques, I’ve talked to the international student advisors, all the St. Louis, international student advisors at the various universities and colleges get together, I spoke at the Human Resources Management Association, meeting on immigration. And what I always do is I bring a clipboard with a signup sheet so that people can get added to my mailing list. So it’s one thing for them to have your business card, but it’s a whole other thing for you to capture their contact information. So you can add them to your contact list and so that they get your weekly email. We it’s
Tyson Mutrux
funny whenever we went to that gymnastic event and spoke at that, and launched that website, and I split them into Infusionsoft. And so it was, I can’t remember it was I think, Jim and tyson.com, or Tyson and jim.com, one of the two, I still owe the domain. So if someone’s go to it, you’ll see it. And we offered the course materials out if you remember that, but we offered the course materials that they emailed me. And so it was that they emailed me or if they sign up through the landing page, the course materials were emailed to them. So there’s a lot of creative ways you can collect their information.
Jim Hacking
Yeah. And you know, you’re talking earlier by going back to the law schools and speaking to the students. That’s how you and I became friends. Because I was speaking at the law school, I was talking, teaching that class on how to run a law practice. And that’s how this whole thing got started.
Tyson Mutrux
Yeah, somehow I was confused. And I’ve seen all this credibility, I thought you’re actually a good attorney. I didn’t. It’s a good way of really confusing people and making them think that your attorney is really not
Jim Hacking
going to punch you in the face.
Tyson Mutrux
So what’s your bonus? All right.
Jim Hacking
So bonus is get lucky. Get Lucky. And I’ve been real lucky when it comes to getting publicity. Last week, my sister was at a fundraiser for her girls school. And they it was an auction. And the person who was running the auction was a guy named Ray Hartman, who’s a local media figure. There’s a show in St. Louis called Donnybrook, where they get together once a week and talk about local politics. Pretty Harvin is a raging liberal. And he was talking to my sister at the fundraiser about how he was working on an immigration story. And my sister said, oh, you know, my brother’s an immigration attorney. So she set it up. And he set it up that they he interviewed me for about an hour and a half our column that he’s publishing in next month, St. Louis magazine, and I got really lucky. But the way you get lucky, I think is by, you know, again, narrowly defining what it is that you do being the go to guru on that topic. And just being available and being smart about how you convey what it is that you do, you want to convey to people that are talking to you, they know what you’re talking about. So you do have to know what you’re talking about. But at the same time, you do need a little bit of luck, a lot of the connections that I’ve had have come from, you know, sort of like that Kevin Bacon game, I knew one person who introduced me to another person who introduced me to another person. And it really just leads to thing. So you’ve got to sort of have that mindset of finding the opportunities, making the most of them and then being open to staying connected and expanding your connections. Well, yeah, and
Tyson Mutrux
you call it luck. I’m not necessarily sure. I mean, there is some sort of luck involved in this. But I mean, you’ve been hustling for a long time, given creating all these connections. It’s all about that I find that if I’m sort of sitting there and not doing anything, if I’ve noticed, I haven’t really done any marketing in a while, then because I’m not hustling or something. You’ve got to keep doing something. You’ve got to have a plan moving forward and in you do that. So it’s really not a whole lot of luck involved. I think when you think you just work hard and so I think that’s a big part of the people get to keep moving and keep keep doing things, keep marketing, keep meeting people keep networking, whatever it may be. So but I’ll step off myself for a second and tell us what your hack of the week is.
Jim Hacking
So So we have talked every now and then on this podcast, but more often just you and I talking about Ryan Deiss, and the Digital Marketer space and they have a podcast that I listened to off and on, but I started to go back and listen to it. It’s called perpetual traffic. And Ryan Deiss isn’t on there that much. And Ryan Deiss has built like 30 companies all on the backs of social media. And this is sort of his social media coordinator and two other people from a company called dominate web media. And it’s really, really good. It’s very tactical. And going back and listening to the early episodes, it’s mostly devoted towards Facebook advertising, and sort of the whole generate leads conversion and signing people up. And every time I listen to it, I think to myself, Man, I should listen to this more often. It really is a masterclass. In social media marketing, I haven’t found any other podcasts that are quite as practical and as substantive as these guys are. And I really feel like if I just implemented a 10th of what it is that they talked about, my social media strategy would be a heck of a lot better.
Tyson Mutrux
And social media is really tricky when I think so I think you need some sort of guidance like that. And so I think the podcasts like, that’s great. What’s the name of the podcast against
Jim Hacking
perpetual traffic? Yeah, they’re in Episode 80 or so
Tyson Mutrux
they’re really good. In a good part, what they talked about is just they break down everything, whether it be conversion, or driving traffic, or whatever it may be. They really break down what they do, which is a really good one. My tip of the week is unrelated to anything we talked about today, Lucid Chart, it’s an app that I downloaded lucid charts been around for a while they’ve had an extension for Google Chrome for a long time, I’ve never really used up. But what I’ve started doing is Lucid Chart, you can actually diagram things very easily. You don’t have your phone, your iPad, whatever it may be. And I’ve been diagramming our system. And so for people as we grow as people that are not, they don’t like to read what the system is, they can actually visually see it. And so it’s really easy to use, use it all with your fingers. Tap drag site. Pretty simple. So Lucid Chart is the free app. There is a paid version, which I ended up upgrading to you can have more charts, but you could get by with the with the free version. All you do is you create the chart and then delete it do another one. But if you want to save the charts get upgrade to the paid account, which I think is 299 or something like that pretty cheap. $2.09 All right.
